Dolphin, the GameCube and Wii emulator - Forums

(05-02-2013, 05:24 PM)admin89 Wrote: [ -> ]Project 64 2.0 is beta . Do not use it , i tried ....So disappointed (StarCraft 64 does not work perfectly like it used to , don't know about other games , thay may work better who know)

Quote:i guess ill upgrade to 1.6.1

Fixed

Double fixed

(05-02-2013, 11:01 PM)ExtremeDude2 Wrote: [ -> ]Yo, you guys know that 2.1 is out right?

I'll try it when i get home, thanks!

noah Wrote:What is the best screen capturing program out there for doing how-to videos and gaming (emulation and PC games)? I have heard of Fraps and Bandicam, and also screencast-o-matic, but I have no idea what to use for my new YouTube channel.

"The best" is subjective. Use whatever you want. For gaming I use fraps. But for desktop screen capture you'll need something else.

Dxtory is very good but it's not free.

Quote:But for desktop screen capture you'll need something else.

Why? FRAPS works perfectly fine for desktop recording.
Simply enable Monitor Aero Desktop in the general tab.

I retract my statement then. Is anyone going to offer me any opinions on whether or not I should upgrade my HTPC build to a 3570?

You already have a high-end system like that, why build another? I thought the idea was to buy something cheap like the "AMD E-Series" that can get the job done? At least that was your plan the last time you talked about it on IRC from what I could tell.

Yes it was. Long story short I gave up on that idea. It won't significantly reduce noise but it will be a lot slower. One of the things that made me decide against it was when I realized that I wouldn't be able to run bsnes anywhere near fullspeed on it. Which from what I gather is currently the best SNES emulator if you have hardware powerful enough to run it. It will cost a bit more but I think it's worth it.

Quote:You already have a high-end system like that, why build another?

This is a question I've been asking myself a lot lately in order to try and justify one decision over the other. My "gaming rig" is in my bedroom hooked up to my 1920 x 1200 24" monitor and some crappy low end old bookshelf speakers ($25 on ebay, yeah, that bad). It's very cramped. So cramped that I have found it to be very difficult and uncomfortable to play dolphin with a wiimote on it. Since I can only sit a few feet away from the montitor the wiimote becomes very hard to control and acts very strangely. I didn't have this problem back when I had it in the living room. I'm not sure why but it seems like you need to be at least 5 ft. away from the IR source in order for the wiimote pointer to respond properly.

This PC will be in the living room hooked up to a 32" 720p Vizio HDTV and my 5.1 surround sound system with decent bookshelf speakers (the whole audio system including the receiver only cost me $425 since I bought everything on ebay, it's easily equivalent to a $800-$1,000 system). I don't have a couch in my living room but I do have:



Seriously it's a wonderfully comfortable chair compared to the cheap office chair that I had in my bedroom. Anyways I find it to be a better setup for playing console games. Especially the wii. It's just too bad that I need high end hardware to emulate a lot of the better Wii titles properly. What makes me think that I could get away with the Pentium cpu is the fact that dolphin and all of the other emulators except pcsx2 are either dual core or single core apps. And I could always use my main rig for pcsx2 if need be since I can use a proper ps2 style controller.

For everything that I plan to do with it except high end emulation an E series 1.65 GHz cpu/motherboard combo would do just fine. Or a Zotac 2.13Ghz atom/nvidia 520m/motherboard combo. Or a Sandy Bridge Dual Core Celeron 1.1GHz/motherboard combo + G 610 graphics card. The last one being the best and the middle actually being the most expensive.

Anyways I need to go so I'll have to continue this post later.

NaturalViolence Wrote:One of the things that made me decide against it was when I realized that I wouldn't be able to run bsnes anywhere near fullspeed on it. Which from what I gather is currently the best SNES emulator if you have hardware powerful enough to run it.

NaturalViolence Wrote:"The best" is subjective.

Quantify which properties you're after in an SNES emulator, then you can decide if bsnes fits your needs. If you want its extreme accuracy, then go for it. For most people, myself included, I don't really need that much accuracy, especially not for the games I play. I suggest looking at what bsnes can do over what other emulators can't (boot a certain game, glitchless games that are troublesome on other emulators, more features supported, etc). For me, it's just not compelling enough to not stick with SNES9x, and I've been emulating SNES games for almost a decade now. However accurate bsnes is, I can't say I'm honestly missing out on some breathtaking experience. For others, that's the deal-breaker, and I respect that. I can only advise you to decide whether or not bsnes, for you, has any true advantages.

Fwiw though, I've heard that byuu did make a version that could run "cheaply" by having less accurate emulation. Not related, but I got bsnes to run (its code powers SNES emulation in mednafen) on the RPi. It was a nice slideshow.

NaturalViolence Wrote:For everything that I plan to do with it except high end emulation an E series 1.65 GHz cpu/motherboard combo would do just fine. Or a Zotac 2.13Ghz atom/nvidia 520m/motherboard combo. Or a Sandy Bridge Dual Core Celeron 1.1GHz/motherboard combo + G 610 graphics card. The last one being the best and the middle actually being the most expensive.

Hey, what a coincidence. As you probably know from my emu-console rants, I'm always searching for a better device dedicated to emulation with a footprint thereabouts the Wii. I've stumbled across several Zotac ZBOX models (one with a 2.13GHz Atom and one with 1.2GHz Intel Celeron 857). I'm still trying to decide on an upgrade to my MK803 that will cost me less than $300. We're kinda, sorta in the same boat, right?

Anyway, I'd say the most important factor here is decided what level of emulation to really want, what can be extra (if it works, cool, if not, no big deal), and what you simply don't care about. How essential is GC/Wii/PS2 emulation to your overall satisfaction with your endeavor? If you were only able to achieve some level of emulation, would this be satisfactory? How much do you expect to emulate these consoles? Would you use Dolphin or PCSX2 more or less on your HTPC than you currently do on your desktop?

I ask myself those kinds of questions whenever I see a potential product that I would re-work into an emu-console. Of course, I'm only concerned with emulating the N64 and PSX at the most, so I have a bit more options than you probably do (cheaper ones too). If it were me, I usually aim low the first time I start off on a project like this. Some GC/Wii/PS2 emulation would satisfy me (TimeSplitters 2 on Dolphin runs on just about anything fullspeed, that's good fun right there), and I'd definitely want Desmume to run well (don't know if you're too into the DS though :p). The next HTPC I'd build (and there would be a next one) would definitely run Dolphin and PCSX2 to an even greater extent.

Shonumi Wrote:Quantify which properties you're after in an SNES emulator, then you can decide if bsnes fits your needs. If you want its extreme accuracy, then go for it.

I want am SNES emulator that "just works". As in as few issues out of the box as possible. Greater accuracy is generally equated with fewer issues so I figure that bsnes is unquestionably the best choice. Now whether the others are "good enough" remains to be seen. I really don't want to do extensive testing of various titles to find out.

Shonumi Wrote:Fwiw though, I've heard that byuu did make a version that could run "cheaply" by having less accurate emulation. Not related, but I got bsnes to run (its code powers SNES emulation in mednafen) on the RPi. It was a nice slideshow.

Not cheaply enough. Atom and E series APUs are ridiculously slow compared to modern desktop cpus. In single threaded apps they are the equivalent of a late pentium 4 era desktop (2002-2004). They are slow enough to make windows xp run poorly even with plenty of ram and a fast HDD. A custom linux distro would probably run ok though.

Shonumi Wrote:Hey, what a coincidence. As you probably know from my emu-console rants, I'm always searching for a better device dedicated to emulation with a footprint thereabouts the Wii. I've stumbled across several Zotac ZBOX models (one with a 2.13GHz Atom and one with 1.2GHz Intel Celeron 857). I'm still trying to decide on an upgrade to my MK803 that will cost me less than $300. We're kinda, sorta in the same boat, right? Big Grin

We're in exactly the same boat. I bought an mk808 (the successor to the mk803). Without writing an essay on this let me just say that for an htpc it's a load of crap.

I originally wanted to do the same thing. Replace it with a tiny wii sized box running a <20 watt cpu. I too looked long and hard at the zbox series and in fact almost bought one. I also considered other prebuilt systems, barebone systems, the Intel NUC, and various cpu/gpu/motherboard all in one boards.

I'll post more about the research that I did during this experience and why it led me away from that idea later. I'm too tired right now.

I plan to try and run linux on it unless it becomes too much of a pain. What's the status of N64 emulation on linux compared to project64?

Actually since you have lots of linux emulation experience what's the status of emulation for each major nintendo/sony console (including handhelds) compared to windows?

Shonumi Wrote:Anyway, I'd say the most important factor here is decided what level of emulation to really want, what can be extra (if it works, cool, if not, no big deal), and what you simply don't care about.

This is a very hard question to answer without building and testing all of the possible alternatives. There is so little review data out there about this stuff for some strange reason. Everyone is talking about htpcs all over the internet and its various forums yet so few hardware manufacturers and review organizations seem to even acknowledge their existence. I guess it could actually be a small market since the lack of marketing has left your average consumer with no awareness of the existence of these types of systems.

Whatever I choose, I'm going to regret it and wish I had made the other choice. This is the problem with modern capitalism, too many god damn choices. It makes you less satisfied with the choices you make because you manage to convince yourself that things would have been better if you had made the other choice. I really want to get this right.

Shonumi Wrote:How essential is GC/Wii/PS2 emulation to your overall satisfaction with your endeavor? If you were only able to achieve some level of emulation, would this be satisfactory? How much do you expect to emulate these consoles? Would you use Dolphin or PCSX2 more or less on your HTPC than you currently do on your desktop?

I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. And I don't know.

Yeah I know, not very helpful. But it's the truth.

NaturalViolence Wrote:I want am SNES emulator that "just works". As in as few issues out of the box as possible. Greater accuracy is generally equated with fewer issues so I figure that bsnes is unquestionably the best choice. Now whether the others are "good enough" remains to be seen. I really don't want to do extensive testing of various titles to find out.

Well, I've played enough of SNES9x to tell you that you'd be very unlucky to come across any bug that you'd 1) notice enough to care or 2) consider detrimental to your gaming experience. bsnes is as accurate as you can get yes, but SNES9x has a high enough accuracy (probably ZSNES too) where it's largely irrelevant.

NaturalViolence Wrote:We're in exactly the same boat. I bought an mk808 (the successor to the mk803). Without writing an essay on this let me just say that for an htpc it's a load of crap.

I originally wanted to do the same thing. Replace it with a tiny wii sized box running a <20 watt cpu. I too looked long and hard at the zbox series and in fact almost bought one. I also considered other prebuilt systems, barebone systems, the Intel NUC, and various cpu/gpu/motherboard all in one boards.

I'll post more about the research that I did during this experience and why it led me away from that idea later. I'm too tired right now.

Hmm, I've never actually played any media on my MK803. The first thing I did was load up some emulators and start playing. I was disappointed to find that it couldn't do PSX or N64 emulation (I expected at least PSX), so I'm on the hunt again. Turns out the MK803 is pretty weak even among its peers. Don't get me wrong; it's great for playing Advance Wars or Super Metroid on my TV, but I need something more.

Personally, I'd like a non-Android solution. The emulators I have on my PC are very flexible, and there's almost nothing I can't emulate (even the Game.com). I think something from the zbox series would be good for me since I have a good feel of the hardware requirements now for various emulators on Linux. With OpenGL, Mednafen will have plenty of resources on an E2200 at 2.20 GHz or a T3400 @ 2.16 GHz. My only concern is the comparative IPC of these CPUs versus, say, an Intel Atom D525 @ 1.80 GHz. The answer is obviously "a lot more" I'm just wondering if it'll be enough to worry over.

Let me know about the research you've done. If it turns out something like the zbox won't get me where I want to be, I'm always looking for an answer to my emu-console project.

NaturalViolence Wrote:I plan to try and run linux on it unless it becomes too much of a pain. What's the status of N64 emulation on linux compared to project64?

Actually since you have lots of linux emulation experience what's the status of emulation for each major nintendo/sony console (including handhelds) compared to windows?

• NES - Perfect with FCEUX. Cross-platform, essentially the same program as on Windows.
  
• SNES - Unless you are byuu and examine each game under a microscope, it's perfect from a player's perspective with SNES9x. Both bsnes and SNES9x are cross-platform and are largely the same programs on Windows or Linux.
  
• Virtual Boy (no joke) - Mednafen is cross-platform, same code as Linux and Windows. Actually your only decent option of playing the VB, since no others for Linux (and Windows?) output sound, use hardware acceleration, or allow you to configure the controls.
  
• N64 - Only real option is Mupen64Plus on Linux. 1.5 comes with a GUI, newer versions are CLI only. I have not tried PJ64, but Mupen64Plus has a very high compatibility, though most likely slightly lower than PJ64. Some games have minor issues, but most play well from start to finish.
  
• Gamecube - Gekko is an amazing emulator, currently the best for GC emula... Dolphin's compatibility is very high, and the OpenGL plugin has come along recently. Aside from not being able to use Direct3D (no 3D vision, can't Ignore Format Changes) the same code is running on both OSes for the most part.
  
• Wii - Dolphin, same as above.
  
• WiiU - Dolphin Pro, same as above, only better.
  
• GB/GBC - VBAM is cross-platform, and from what I know from my GB emulator development, it's very accurate. Linux version doesn't have a debugger (probably worthless to you :p) nor does it have netplay (also probably worthless). Other than that, it's the same program. Pretty much perfect.
  
• GBA - VBAM, same as above.
  
• DS - Desmume is cross-platform, and it's your best bet for DS emulation. Essentially the same on Windows and Linux (less debugging info on Linux). The latest SVN revisions just included scaling filters like HQ2X for Linux; previously it was Windows (and OS X?) only. OpenGL as a 3D renderer is buggy across all OSes, but the recompiler in recent SVN builds makes up for SW rendering pretty. The Linux CLI version can use SDL+OpenGL for 2D hardware acceleration (takes raw screen data, puts it to OpenGL texture, then blits it) and that speeds up things a bit as well. Only a few games have outstanding issues (Golden Sun is slow, Pokemon has save issues, that's about it)
  
• 3DS - I haven't released it yet. Plus, it's a secret to everyone.
  

• Playstation - While you can run ePSXe on Linux (32-bit only) and use all of the plugins, it's an older version. PCSX-R is a better solution since it has a more modern/comprehensive GUI and it can still use ePSXe plugins. That said, I use neither of them for 2D games. Mednafen has "experimental" PSX support that just happens to be better than anything else I've tried on Linux. I've said this before, but I absolutely could not get Star Ocean 2 to run perfectly in either ePSXe or PCSX-R, Linux or Windows. Each has issues with video sync and sound. Mednafen ran it perfectly the first time (which floored me, literally, I fell when my laptop ran it). Valkyrie Profile is tricky too in ePSXe and PCSX-R; not so in Mednafen. If you're not CLI inclined, Mednafen has a GUI; you'll want the latest source as well. Again, Mednafen itself is cross-platform. For 3D games, I use PCSX-R. Mednafen doesn't have an equivalent to Internal Resolution.
  
• Playstation 2 - Guess I've already touched on PCSX2. OpenGL only really works for a handful of games. The SW renderer is much nicer, though it can be demanding. Sub-optimal until the Linux GSDX version has hardware acceleration and support for custom resolutions (you're stuck at native, and fullscreen does some sort of linear interpolation to stretch the image, meh).
  
• Playstation 3 - All are fakes, for Windows no less.
  
• Playstation 4 - :|
  
• PSP - JPCSP is the PSP emulator. Largely the same as the Windows version due to its use of Java. Perfect PSP emulation on Linux can either work for you after some tedious leg-work or destroy your confidence in software before you even get there. PSP games use some proprietary ATRAC format that can only be decoded using SonicStage, which is Windows only. The Windows JPCSP can use SonicStage to decode these sound files on the fly. Linux users have to dump the audio files, somehow run SonicStage (through WINE, or just a virtualized Windows install) along with some other programs (it's a bizarre process) and then put these files back. Due to the naming convention of these files being Windows orientated, the dumped/decoded files are written as tmp\game_id\sound_file.ac3. In Windows, this saves it to JPCSP's tmp folder. In Linux, this just creates a file in JPCSP's root directory called "tmp\game_id\sound_file.ac3". You can't manually move it to tmp, since it won't find it (it'll look like tmp/game_id/sound_file.ac3 when it expects tmp\game_id\sound_file.ac3). You will also need to do this in order to watch movies. PPSSPP is an up and coming PSP emulator for basically anything the author (former Dolphin founder I hear) can code for. Got it to compile and run Disgaea 2; compatibility isn't quite as high as JPCSP, but it's growing all the time. Eventually they want to reverse-engineer the PSP custom ATRAC format so that it can be played natively. I'm watching this one.
  
• Vita - The Vita has no games. There will never be an emulator for this.
  

NaturalViolence Wrote:I don't know. I don't know. I don't know. And I don't know.

Yeah I know, not very helpful. But it's the truth.

When in doubt, pimp it out. Like I said, when I first start off on these projects, usually go in very conservatively at first, then get it right the next time if I'm not satisfied. For you though, I imagine you'd rather have dent in your wallet over having performance less than desired and still having to dent your wallet to later fix it. So as a definite answer, you might as well go with the 3570.