I don't care about what it does, I just want to be able to say "we emulate GCN on GCN".
AMD Mantle - New API
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(09-29-2013, 12:54 AM)Shonumi Wrote: EDIT : Seems it's limited to the GCN architecture though (AMD only?). TechSpot Wrote:We've been told at the GPU14 Tech Day event that the Mantle API is open, so theoretically Nvidia could purpose the technology in their GPUs. It should also make cross-development between PC and console games a lot easier, and also more incredible for those with a high-performance AMD GPU.TechSpot PCGH however stated the following: Quote:"PCGH asked Raja Koduri about Mantle and its "openness". He replied that AMD doesn't see Mantle as an open standard like OpenCL or OpenGL."PCGamesHardware (German) 09-29-2013, 01:10 AM
@Garteal - Thanks Googling right now is actually a pain on my iPod for some reason (slow/bad connection). I'd love to see Intel go after it then, since their HD IGPs seem to be getting more of their attention (probably because they want to play in the mobile field).
09-29-2013, 08:37 AM
Someone pointed out in the comments of something that nVidia offered to let AMD/ATi use PhysX, which they refused, because they backed Intel's Havok Engine (and not for any technical reason such as mismatched ISAs). If this is the standard way to operate, then nVidia won't support mantle (because it belongs to AMD), especially as it'll be like trying to emulate a different chip as opposed to running platform independent code directly. If this post deosn't make some kind of sense, then it's because I had to be up really early, and it's now slightly late.
OS: Windows 10 64 bit Professional
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5900X RAM: 48GB GPU: Radeon 7800 XT 09-29-2013, 09:23 AM
(09-29-2013, 08:37 AM)AnyOldName3 Wrote: Someone pointed out in the comments of something that nVidia offered to let AMD/ATi use PhysX, which they refused, because they backed Intel's Havok Engine (and not for any technical reason such as mismatched ISAs). Do you have a reference? Also, they are different. PhysX is a physics engine whereas Mantle is just an API. Nvidia can support this API if they want to. 09-29-2013, 09:40 AM
There seem to be conflicting reports on whether Mantle is an open standard or not. If this will only work on AMD's GPUs/APUs, considering that they're supplying chips for all the major consoles, then... Wow, this could be Glide3d all over again.
I couldn't identify a GPU's ASM if you nailed it to my forehead. So, can someone answer if GCN is just too different from Kepler in order to port the API? Or do we not have enough details yet? 09-29-2013, 09:45 AM
I read this in a (well cited) comment on a tech article which I can't remember the hosting organisation of.
Also, something high level such as a physics engine is relatively easy to port, as you can recompile a lot of it to get it to work as it's more abstracted. Because Mantle is very low level, it skips straight over the parts where AMD and nVidia chips are the same. I'm going to draw an analogy to interpreted languages and compiled languages/assembly. PhysX is basically just another program in many ways. If nVidia give AMD source code, it can either be interpreted directly, or be recompiled for GCN. Mantle, however is much lower level. You can sort of consider it like GCN's assembly language (although it isn't, as it's higher level than that). Either way, it interfaces with hardware at a level at which it's very different to nVidia's. Of course, this is all dependant on a single comment, albiet a well cited one, on a forgotten article, on a forgotten site being right.
OS: Windows 10 64 bit Professional
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5900X RAM: 48GB GPU: Radeon 7800 XT 09-29-2013, 02:54 PM
(09-29-2013, 12:54 AM)Shonumi Wrote: So it's possible that other vendors could come up with their own implementations for the Mantle API?Been there done that not interested in going back. (09-29-2013, 09:23 AM)xemnas Wrote:(09-29-2013, 08:37 AM)AnyOldName3 Wrote: Someone pointed out in the comments of something that nVidia offered to let AMD/ATi use PhysX, which they refused, because they backed Intel's Havok Engine (and not for any technical reason such as mismatched ISAs). GX is just an API, so PCs can just support the API if they wanted, right? Guys, right? >_> (in case you don't know, GX is the GC/Wii GPU API) tl;dr: NV will never support Mantle, period. 09-29-2013, 11:55 PM
I thought as much. Still, there's very little stopping them from coming up with their own API which behaves similarly. The only issue there is that all engines would have to be written for D3D (for older cards), Mantle, and a third API. I don't see many companies bothering with that.
OS: Windows 10 64 bit Professional
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5900X RAM: 48GB GPU: Radeon 7800 XT |
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