05-05-2010, 10:33 PM
05-06-2010, 03:59 AM
Quote:I don't see many people getting 4.6, and you must understand that Overclocking isn't something universal on all chip; people may get lucky and get a chip (both I7 and Thuban) that could go very high but most will not. There are also many other thing to factor (cooling, ram, mobo, OC're skill etc etc)
I know. I'm just saying you can't get an i7 to 4.6 on air, period, no matter how lucky you are. The OC range for people with thuban using air cooling seems to be 4.0-4.6. While the max OC range for i7 920 on air seems to be 3.8-4.0. I haven't seen anybody get an i7 to 4.2 stable without liquid. It might be possible with a really low ambient temp. though. In general thuban does clock higher, that is clear as day for me. Even a bad thuban will clock higher than a good i7.
Quote:No, I do not plan to OC...for now, but I'm just going to buy a budget CPU for now with a motherboard that has Phenom II X4/6 support.
here is what i plan to get:
AMD Phenom II X4 945 Deneb 3.0GHz 4 x 512KB L2 Cache 6MB L3 Cache Socket AM3 95W Quad-Core Processor
and
ASUS M4A89GTD PRO/USB3 AM3 AMD 890GX HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard or unless someone can make another suggestion that supports Phenom II x4/6 with USB 3.0 (I just want it to have it ya know?)
Sorry for the very late response, I have been busy lately...
A good choice. Although if you ONLY interested in emulators I would recommend an i3/i5 instead. Even if you don't OC, but especially if you OC.
05-06-2010, 04:48 PM
I don't personally know enough people with 920, so I googled it,it seems people can push that chip (920) to 4.7 and higher on air though. I found instantly many results. In this topic are 2 people who clocked it to above 4.6 using aircooler
http://i4memory.com/f80/i7-920-4769mhz-true120-air-13746/
There seems to be plenty more of oc'ers that can do the same on various forums. It requires upping the voltage though so you should be careful if attempting.
But I don't agree that you can only get 4.2 on liquid at all. Because I have 950 which is basically the same chip made from similar die wafer, and it will go to 4.2 on the air cooler that came with it (made by intel) without any modification on manageable temps. Google results also indicate this is one of the most common oc speeds for users with air cooling and 920 chip. It will also go higher if you acquired the d0 stepping of it.
http://i4memory.com/f80/i7-920-4769mhz-true120-air-13746/
There seems to be plenty more of oc'ers that can do the same on various forums. It requires upping the voltage though so you should be careful if attempting.
But I don't agree that you can only get 4.2 on liquid at all. Because I have 950 which is basically the same chip made from similar die wafer, and it will go to 4.2 on the air cooler that came with it (made by intel) without any modification on manageable temps. Google results also indicate this is one of the most common oc speeds for users with air cooling and 920 chip. It will also go higher if you acquired the d0 stepping of it.
05-06-2010, 05:01 PM
And Thuban is still a really new tech, you can't really proclaim the general result before giving it more time. And I think i7 4.2 on air is pretty common, it's not that elusive if you look around.
05-07-2010, 03:31 AM
Quote:I don't personally know enough people with 920, so I googled it,it seems people can push that chip (920) to 4.7 and higher on air though. I found instantly many results. In this topic are 2 people who clocked it to above 4.6 using aircooler
http://i4memory.com/f80/i7-920-4769mhz-t...air-13746/
There seems to be plenty more of oc'ers that can do the same on various forums. It requires upping the voltage though so you should be careful if attempting.
But I don't agree that you can only get 4.2 on liquid at all. Because I have 950 which is basically the same chip made from similar die wafer, and it will go to 4.2 on the air cooler that came with it (made by intel) without any modification on manageable temps. Google results also indicate this is one of the most common oc speeds for users with air cooling and 920 chip. It will also go higher if you acquired the d0 stepping of it.
Interesting. Back when i7 920 first came out no tech review sites were able to get it past 4.2 without liquid. So either the cpu has improved over time with stepping, we've gotten better air coolers out on the market (which I know is true), or these results are rare (which I also know is true if you read the rest of the thread that you linked). I also noticed they all had HT disabled, that's why they were able to get it so high. Most serious OCers turn off ht because it significantly reduces tdp. With HT off you can get a couple hundred megahertz higher than with ht on. I would like to see them get to 4.2 on air with ht on and see what their temps are. Which for some reason the people in that thread also didn't list.
950 is not basically the same chip, they clock significantly higher than a 920 does on average. I am amazed you got to 4.2 on stock cooling, what are your temps if you don't mind me asking?
05-07-2010, 11:17 AM
In idle BIOS core 1 and 2 is around 49 and core 3 & 4 is about 52. But then again I never overclock with hyperthreading turned on, and play dolphin and most games on stock voltage/frequency.
I'd still like to note that all the i7 chips are made from the safe wafer (they are literally identical), with the exception of the newest 980x. They get graded based on efficiency (called binning in the lithography process) and then rebranded as a model number (or if they totally fail, discarded).
Here is an extensive article that shows how a cpu chip is made (it particularly uses the i7 series as an example).
http://www.techzug.com/index.php/miscellaneous/intel-shows-how-a-processor-is-made.html
A 920 is exactly the same chip as a 975 extreme edition, 965 or a 950, the only difference is that during the binning process it would stand much lower clocking rates than those model numbers require. There are absolutely zero physical differences, the QPI speed is also locked on the die, it's not an exclusive feature. The chips that perform the best during binning are given an unlocked cpu multiplier for clock rates & branded as extreme edition. The EE processor is just a standard 920 that was exceptionally well performing under stress.
The same thing occurs with all models that are uniform (such as most core 2 quad processors). Apart from differences in L2 cache size they are the exactly same processor as every other model in the series, just capable of different stable clock rates.
I'd still like to note that all the i7 chips are made from the safe wafer (they are literally identical), with the exception of the newest 980x. They get graded based on efficiency (called binning in the lithography process) and then rebranded as a model number (or if they totally fail, discarded).
Here is an extensive article that shows how a cpu chip is made (it particularly uses the i7 series as an example).
http://www.techzug.com/index.php/miscellaneous/intel-shows-how-a-processor-is-made.html
A 920 is exactly the same chip as a 975 extreme edition, 965 or a 950, the only difference is that during the binning process it would stand much lower clocking rates than those model numbers require. There are absolutely zero physical differences, the QPI speed is also locked on the die, it's not an exclusive feature. The chips that perform the best during binning are given an unlocked cpu multiplier for clock rates & branded as extreme edition. The EE processor is just a standard 920 that was exceptionally well performing under stress.
The same thing occurs with all models that are uniform (such as most core 2 quad processors). Apart from differences in L2 cache size they are the exactly same processor as every other model in the series, just capable of different stable clock rates.
05-07-2010, 11:26 AM
4.7ghz on air not possible unless chilled air or for validation purposes only. Max with stability is about 4.2ghz.
05-07-2010, 02:07 PM
@Ocean
1. Holy crap! 52 C on bios idle! That's kind of high (unless temp. change from idle to full load is lower than most other cpus, I don't have an i7 myself so I wouldn't know). What are your full load temps? The fact that you got that high on stock leads me to believe that intel's stock coolers have improved a lot since core 2.
2. Yes I know all of that. They are the same chip but the way you were talking in your post made it sound like you were saying an i7 920 user could expect to get the same oc results as an i7 950 user like yourself since they're essentially the same thing, and as you clearly already know that's not true, they can clock a lot higher. I think I mis-phrased what I meant to say, I made it sound like I thought they were different microarchitectures.
It is possible but only if:
1. You have an excellent mobo which is kept cool
2. You are extremely lucky and you get a very good chip
3. You leave ht off
4. You only use 3 of the 6 ram dimms.
5. You have a top of the line air cooler ($70-100)
6. Your room temperature is relatively low
7. You have some OCing experience (not really a requirement but the people that pull these levels of OCing off are clearly pros)
1. Holy crap! 52 C on bios idle! That's kind of high (unless temp. change from idle to full load is lower than most other cpus, I don't have an i7 myself so I wouldn't know). What are your full load temps? The fact that you got that high on stock leads me to believe that intel's stock coolers have improved a lot since core 2.
2. Yes I know all of that. They are the same chip but the way you were talking in your post made it sound like you were saying an i7 920 user could expect to get the same oc results as an i7 950 user like yourself since they're essentially the same thing, and as you clearly already know that's not true, they can clock a lot higher. I think I mis-phrased what I meant to say, I made it sound like I thought they were different microarchitectures.
Quote:4.7ghz on air not possible unless chilled air or for validation purposes only. Max with stability is about 4.2ghz.
It is possible but only if:
1. You have an excellent mobo which is kept cool
2. You are extremely lucky and you get a very good chip
3. You leave ht off
4. You only use 3 of the 6 ram dimms.
5. You have a top of the line air cooler ($70-100)
6. Your room temperature is relatively low
7. You have some OCing experience (not really a requirement but the people that pull these levels of OCing off are clearly pros)
05-07-2010, 05:39 PM
I'm afraid to run prime95 and other stress tests on maximum overclock for long, because temps go to like 95+c & I just end up shutting it down, lol.
To be honest, oc'ing is only a boasting sport with little real-world usage for ordinary use after a certain point. Your overclock is the typical example of a reasonable OC that will bring performance gains for games at a stable frequency.
But if a user is only playing games, reading email, maybe doing some 3d modelling or compiling.. Why would he run a processor past 4.5ghz continuously? Not only would it shorten the lifespan of the cpu but it's also a considerable waste of electricity.
I just don't see the point to operate beyond 3.5 to 4.0ghz for every day casual use.
To be honest, oc'ing is only a boasting sport with little real-world usage for ordinary use after a certain point. Your overclock is the typical example of a reasonable OC that will bring performance gains for games at a stable frequency.
But if a user is only playing games, reading email, maybe doing some 3d modelling or compiling.. Why would he run a processor past 4.5ghz continuously? Not only would it shorten the lifespan of the cpu but it's also a considerable waste of electricity.
I just don't see the point to operate beyond 3.5 to 4.0ghz for every day casual use.
05-08-2010, 11:06 AM
Intel Core i7-930 + MSI N260GTX Twin Frozr OC is a good choice.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115225&cm_re=i7_930-_-19-115-225-_-Product
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103849&Tpk=AMD%20Phenom%20II%20X6%201090T%20Black%20Edition%20Thuban
Its a good choice (for me).
Remember u need a 700w(or +) psu (real watts) for this rig.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115225&cm_re=i7_930-_-19-115-225-_-Product
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103849&Tpk=AMD%20Phenom%20II%20X6%201090T%20Black%20Edition%20Thuban
Its a good choice (for me).
Remember u need a 700w(or +) psu (real watts) for this rig.