(12-04-2017, 04:26 PM)Nintendo Maniac 64 Wrote: [ -> ]I'm not that paranoid about it, and honestly I want to know how Ryzen performs myself since I may be interested in a Ryzen APU-based system in the future as I've been following Ryzen closely since its initial unveiling around a year ago (so I'm well aware of much of what you stated regarding Ryzen in general).
So post away! Really, my concerns were more about any farther in-depth benchmarking with other CPUs or the like, especially if other users start hi-jacking this thread or get the idea to make a new thread - just posting a couple of your our Ryzen benchmark results in your own thread won't hurt anybody.
Ok!
I have not had as much free time today as I would have liked, so I have not had time to install W7 just yet, but I just ran the luabench on build 6000 (perfect timing with that nice and even number!)
I honestly was thinking that build might not make much of a difference, but even though it is still inferior performance to Intel, I would say this is still more acceptable and inline with what I was hoping for.
Once I have W7 installed and run my benchmarks there, I will edit the OP and include screenshots of the results and very specific build information.
SpaceDandy,
I think that the Dolphin benchmark is backend independent, it's just a test of your CPU's single-core ability. However, this luabench result is more representative of what you are actually getting in-game than the 5.0 stable benchmark suggests, so your results may vary heavily as this is not a stable release, but this should make clear what is possible.
Just so you have some reference points, my G3258 @ 3.9GHz running Win7 SP1 scored 383s (6min 23s) in Dolphin 5.0 and 341s (5min 41s) in Dolphin r6000.
At least compared to your Win10 scores, that would put my G3258 as 22% faster clock-for-clock in Dolphin 5.0 but "only" 14% faster in Dolphin r6000. Ryzen in Dolphin still isn't quite to Haswell levels, but Haswell and newer on the Intel side is weirdly fast at emulation tasks anyway.
All things considered, that's still a decent performance uplift on development builds for Ryzen CPUs. Now the question is, how would Ryzen APUs with their single CCX would fare in Dolphin...?
(12-05-2017, 12:45 PM)Nintendo Maniac 64 Wrote: [ -> ]Just so you have some reference points, my G3258 @ 3.9GHz running Win7 SP1 scored 383s (6min 23s) in Dolphin 5.0 and 341s (5min 41s) in Dolphin r6000.
At least compared to your Win10 scores, that would put my G3258 as 22% faster clock-for-clock in Dolphin 5.0 but "only" 14% faster in Dolphin r6000. Ryzen in Dolphin still isn't quite to Haswell levels, but Haswell and newer on the Intel side is weirdly fast at emulation tasks (at least compared to Ivy Bridge vs non-emulation workloads).
All things considered, that's still a considerable performance uplift on development builds for Ryzen CPUs. Now the question is, how would Ryzen APUs with their single CCX would fare in Dolphin...?
Without a doubt, I am not gunning for the top spot on Dolphin benchmarks with Ryzen - I was fully expecting middle-of-the-road performance, but with those times in luabench on 5.0 build 6000, it puts my 1600x at a faster time than the 1800x on version 5.0 at comparable memory speeds even at 100Mhz higher CPU clock, according to the chart. I would hope it makes it both
quantitatively clear that for dolphin there is no use in more cores on the Ryzen platform, especially with the memory speed speculation floating about.
Still, I hope that once the W7 benches come through (I am expecting no real difference in performance), it will be a useful and more up-to-date reference for people who ask about the performance of Ryzen with Dolphin, now that I feel the platform has stabilized more completely, with both hardware and software.
The APUs will be very interesting to see - I believe they will be using the Vega cores, so IIRC, given that they uses something similar to the infinity fabric, 1T Samsung B-Die memory will likely not be dipping in price any time soon. It would be really awesome to be able to build a reasonable dolphin machine for something like 3 or 400 bucks.
There was a time when you could build a kickass 1080p dolphin system for 300 USD + tax
unfortunately, rising GPU+RAM prices killed that.
(12-05-2017, 02:02 PM)Helios Wrote: [ -> ]There was a time when you could build a kickass 1080p dolphin system for 300 USD + tax
unfortunately, rising GPU+RAM prices killed that.
Building a PC now is like trying to build a server must have been back when all of those typhoons flooded the hard disk manufacturers a few years ago. Cryptocurrencies and the memory shortage is making it painful. The Vega launch failing didn't help things either.
(12-05-2017, 02:02 PM)Helios Wrote: [ -> ]There was a time when you could build a kickass 1080p dolphin system for 300 USD + tax
unfortunately, rising GPU+RAM prices killed that.
Don't forget rising G4560 prices. Though other than that, this year's new CPU releases have certainly helped to offset the increased RAM and GPU prices.
For the life of me I could not get W7 to install and boot successfully on my nvme drive - two different installer ISOs, each tried by DVD and bootable flash drive with multiple re-writes, through usb2 and 3 controllers, all other drives unplugged, etc. Just catches in a boot loop after a "successful" install every time. Going to have to try again tomorrow with a sata ssd. A sata m.2 drive may have worked, but I digress. Another day of delay for what will likely be identical results to W10...
...and the not-so-long-awaited results!
Absolutely NO performance difference with development versions of Dolphin on updated versions of W7 vs. W10 at time of writing! My first test was with the slight overclock of 3.9Ghz, and it performed identically to the exact same overclock on W10 (within margin of error, at any rate). Seeing that, I was assured that the stock clocks would also bring the same results (logically, no reason that they wouldn't) so I went ahead and disabled SMT / multicore / hyperthreading whatever you want to call it for the stock clock test and we were within the margin of error yet again!
Thinking back, I may have been the only person on the internet with this question, but I hope it has been informative. Though of course this is only a single data point, I will post detailed specs here:
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5 1600X
Motherboard: ASUS ROG x370-F GAMING BIOS version 3203
Memory: GSKILL FlareX 3200Mhz 2x8GB 14-14-14-34
Storage device for W10 tests: Samsung 960 EVO NVMe 500GB
Storage device for W7 tests (everything else the same): Samsung 840 EVO 500GB
GPU: Has no impact on the test, but it's an RX 580
Chipset Driver: 17.7
So W7 is viable if you like the OS and want to go through the trouble of installing it! This guide worked for me when installing to a SATA drive - trying to install it to NVME would crash it and bootloop every time.
https://www.anandtech.com/show/11182/how-to-get-ryzen-working-on-windows-7-x64
If anybody has any more questions I would be happy to help, now that the hard part is out of the way and I have a working image of W7 saved for easy re-testing on a blank slate.
(12-06-2017, 10:41 AM)linkdude64 Wrote: [ -> ]For the life of me I could not get W7 to install and boot successfully on my nvme drive - two different installer ISOs, each tried by DVD and bootable flash drive with multiple re-writes, through usb2 and 3 controllers, all other drives unplugged, etc. Just catches in a boot loop after a "successful" install every time. Going to have to try again tomorrow with a sata ssd. A sata m.2 drive may have worked, but I digress. Another day of delay for what will likely be identical results to W10...
Well, what you're expecting? That you would throw an ancient, 8 year-old OS on a shiny new PC with a current generation CPU and lot of technologies and interfaces that didn't even exist when W7 launched and it would just work without troubles? Get ready to also be locked out of security updates and to also not fully enjoy all your CPU and GPU can offer since Ryzen and Kaby Lake are only officially supported on Windows 8/10...
(12-07-2017, 03:44 PM)mbc07 Wrote: [ -> ]Well, what you're expecting? That you would throw an ancient, 8 year-old OS on a shiny new PC with a current generation CPU and lot of technologies and interfaces that didn't even exist when W7 launched and it would just work without troubles? Get ready to also be locked out of security updates and to also not fully enjoy all your CPU and GPU can offer since Ryzen and Kaby Lake are only officially supported on Windows 8/10...
The argument that I cannot fully enjoy what my CPU and GPU can offer on Windows 7 compared to Windows 10 in this context has been
objectively and demonstratively disproven in this very thread. 6 core 12 thread CPUs were
absolutely available and supported when Windows 7 was supported, and the Radeon RX 580 was
absolutely supported when Windows 7 was as well. Knowing that m.2 SATA drives were a thing, I figured there might have been some kind of backward compatibility baked in. With a simple pin adapter you can still run SATA III drives on some 25 year old systems, so I thought it was worth a shot to try. All the software I need to run will run just fine on W7 (whether or not I decide to settle on it), and after some investigation, it's another simple driver slipstream that will enable my NVMe drive to boot, I had just neglected to research that ahead of time.
Everything you're saying about "official support" and "shiny! new! security!" is rolling right off of me. The fact of the matter is that computational trust is broken top to bottom, and operational security with local redundancy is the only way to protect your data. You hear about the Experian CC # leak? You try and convince me that the customers having the Latest Microsoft® Windows© Updates™ protected those folks' identities and info from being stolen. Nope, it was
human error that caused that leak - the lack of patches was utterly inconsequential. The only way for your information to be safe is for it to not be on the net. When your computer is open to M$, it's just one more gaping hole in your security, because every day brings one more opportunity for some M$ employee who didn't drink his coffee in the morning to expose all of that juicy telemetry/login/onedrive/password data of yours, excluding the fact that they have become overtly malicious to their end-users to begin with.
At any rate, if you care to respond, we can just agree to disagree past that. I wanted to show the community what Dolphin under W7 on Ryzen compared to W10 would do, and I accomplished that to the extent I am capable. There is no difference.