Dolphin, the GameCube and Wii emulator - Forums

(10-18-2013, 01:06 AM)Shonumi Wrote: [ -> ]@dh2005 - Well, personally, I can stand to buy a system to only play a handful of games. I really only bought a 360 to play all of the Halo games (except Wars and ODST) + Tales of Vesperia and Star Ocean 4. Ditto for the PS3; I only wanted it so I could play Tales of Xillia (which wasn't even scheduled for localization when I got a PS3, and it came out almost two years later). I really only want the Nintendo staples (Mario, Mario Kart, Metroid, Zelda, SSB, F-Zero, Kirby), so I'd end up buying the system sooner or later. I'm not saying the Wii U is going to be a hit with me, but I usually end up getting systems regardless of how many games I play on them. I might just be frivolous or something :p

Absolutely. I think there's more common ground between our points of view than maybe you realise. I bought the Wii U specifically because of Nintendo's Triple-A franchises - but eleven months later, I'm still waiting for my decision to be vindicated.

New Super Mario Bros. U wasn't very good. It was quite good, but that's not good enough. I traded it before I finished it because the jumping mechanics got so massively on my tits, and I wasn't willing either to suffer through them or to adjust my game (twenty years spent playing Super Mario World, and suddenly Mario starts sticking to walls...? No-fuckin'-thanks). Pikmin 3 was good, and I keep meaning to go back to it - but it hasn't grabbed me so tightly that I've felt compelled to.

Of course, there will be a great Zelda game for the U eventually. Of that I'm certain. But we kinda need it now - and I'm not just talking about Wind Waker HD. And if a Metroid game to rival the quality of Prime were released, honestly, I'd stop moaning instantly. Mario Kart needs to step back from the baby-ish bullshit of Mario Kart Wii if it's to get my interest (my flatmate and me played Super Mario Kart through SNES9x a few nights ago, and I honestly believe that the franchise was never as good again...). The other franchises you mentioned I do enjoy, but less so.



And yes, the PS3 did have a crap start. But the PS3 didn't have two next-generation consoles hitting the market within a year of its release, whereas the Wii U has - and that represents a serious problem. People don't give a shit about the Wii U now, and I believe they'll give even less of a shit when there are two technically superior machines with mammoth promotional budgets behind them competing in the same space.

But wait!!! Here comes the evergreen Nintendo apologist (again, I used to be one...) with the same old riposte... "Nintendo has never been about processing power - it's all about the games". Okay, then. So where are these fucking games? The software highlight of the U's first year is an HD remake of a decade-old game. I've said it before, and I'll say it again - not good enough.



I would love to be wrong. If the U fails and Nintendo withdraw from the home console market, we'll be left with Sony and Microsoft - both of whose machines are essentially the same, with common software. It will mean the death of diversity, and I don't want that - but Nintendo aren't exactly giving me reason to keep the faith.

Nintendo isn't going anywhere, they can afford to make a Wii U 2 and Wii U 3, have both fail and they would still be far from bankruptcy, people are really underestimating the amount of cash Nintendo has in the bank.

(10-20-2013, 07:37 PM)Zee530 Wrote: [ -> ]Nintendo isn't going anywhere, they can afford to make a Wii U 2 and Wii U 3, have both fail and they would still be far from bankruptcy, people are really underestimating the amount of cash Nintendo has in the bank.

I'm not talking about bankruptcy, friend. I'm talking about 'one failure too many' forcing a radical change of corporate direction. Sega didn't cease to exist when the Dreamcast died on its arse - they became a predominantly-software company thereafter because the hardware division was losing too much money, and would have sunk the whole business had that trend continued.

The NES and Super NES were enormously successful, but the N64 and the GameCube did comparatively poorly. Yes, the Wii sold a fuck-ton of consoles, but I believe I'm right in saying that it wasn't as profitable as one might expect because the attach-rate was so poor (I bought my Wii with four bundled games, and never bought another). Nintendo kinda need the U to be a hit, to save themselves from becoming a perennial also-ran in the home console space. If they cease to be 'relevant' in that sphere, would it make corporate sense to continue to work in it...?

dh2005 Wrote:Mario Kart needs to step back from the baby-ish bullshit of Mario Kart Wii if it's to get my interest

You should play Mario Kart 7. It's even better than Mario Kart DS! That game single-handedly restored my hope for Nintendo. It showed that the casualization really was just a fad, and they still have the that special something that makes Nintendo so great.

(10-20-2013, 08:47 PM)dh2005 Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-20-2013, 07:37 PM)Zee530 Wrote: [ -> ]Nintendo isn't going anywhere, they can afford to make a Wii U 2 and Wii U 3, have both fail and they would still be far from bankruptcy, people are really underestimating the amount of cash Nintendo has in the bank.

I'm not talking about bankruptcy, friend. I'm talking about 'one failure too many' forcing a radical change of corporate direction. Sega didn't cease to exist when the Dreamcast died on its arse - they became a predominantly-software company thereafter because the hardware division was losing too much money, and would have sunk the whole business had that trend continued.

The NES and Super NES were enormously successful, but the N64 and the GameCube did comparatively poorly. Yes, the Wii sold a fuck-ton of consoles, but I believe I'm right in saying that it wasn't as profitable as one might expect because the attach-rate was so poor (I bought my Wii with four bundled games, and never bought another). Nintendo kinda need the U to be a hit, to save themselves from becoming a perennial also-ran in the home console space. If they cease to be 'relevant' in that sphere, would it make corporate sense to continue to work in it...?

It's basically a big "what if" right now what you are suggesting and partly you answered it yourself and you haven't noticed, Nintendo didn't left the console space even after two consecutive not very successful products (N64 and Gamecube), so based on past experience it would not be unexpected for the same to happen even if WiiU proves to be a commercial failure in the future. You forget that in mobile gaming they always ruled, and that counters any possible losses for them.

(10-20-2013, 08:51 PM)MaJoR Wrote: [ -> ]

dh2005 Wrote:Mario Kart needs to step back from the baby-ish bullshit of Mario Kart Wii if it's to get my interest

You should play Mario Kart 7. It's even better than Mario Kart DS! That game single-handedly restored my hope for Nintendo. It showed that the casualization really was just a fad, and they still have the that special something that makes Nintendo so great.

See, that's how I want to feel about Nintendo. They have that Nintendo 'something', that can bring a smile to the face of even the most jaded and haggard gaming sour-puss. Pikmin 3 kinda feels that way at its best moments - you think, "see, this is what Nintendo can do that nobody else can...".

But I need more. I need to feel like my faith is being rewarded. Even though I have all the emulators that I could possibly want available to me, I've re-bought all of my favourite NES and SNES games through the Virtual Console - because I want to support Nintendo. I only wish that they didn't make it so fucking difficult for me to do so...

[sigh]

(10-20-2013, 08:58 PM)Link_to_the_past Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-20-2013, 08:47 PM)dh2005 Wrote: [ -> ]

(10-20-2013, 07:37 PM)Zee530 Wrote: [ -> ]Nintendo isn't going anywhere, they can afford to make a Wii U 2 and Wii U 3, have both fail and they would still be far from bankruptcy, people are really underestimating the amount of cash Nintendo has in the bank.

I'm not talking about bankruptcy, friend. I'm talking about 'one failure too many' forcing a radical change of corporate direction. Sega didn't cease to exist when the Dreamcast died on its arse - they became a predominantly-software company thereafter because the hardware division was losing too much money, and would have sunk the whole business had that trend continued.

The NES and Super NES were enormously successful, but the N64 and the GameCube did comparatively poorly. Yes, the Wii sold a fuck-ton of consoles, but I believe I'm right in saying that it wasn't as profitable as one might expect because the attach-rate was so poor (I bought my Wii with four bundled games, and never bought another). Nintendo kinda need the U to be a hit, to save themselves from becoming a perennial also-ran in the home console space. If they cease to be 'relevant' in that sphere, would it make corporate sense to continue to work in it...?

It's basically a big "what if" right now what you are suggesting and partly you answered it yourself and you haven't noticed, Nintendo didn't left the console space even after two consecutive not very successful products (N64 and Gamecube), so based on past experience it would not be unexpected for the same to happen even if WiiU proves to be a commercial failure in the future. You forget that in mobile gaming they always ruled, and that counters any possible losses for them.

Excuse me, but I don't "forget" any such thing. I don't wish to be blunt with you (a courtesy you haven't entirely extended to me...), so I'll simply restate my previous points.

The phrase I used was 'one failure too many'. Inherent within that is the suggestion of multiple failures - but sooner or later these ongoing failures cannot continue to be absorbed - by any part of the business - and a change of corporate direction becomes necessary.

In the mobile market Nintendo certainly do thrive - the DS brand makes a shitload of money, and will likely continue to - but it doesn't follow that Nintendo and their shareholders will continue to support a corporate strategy that seems happy to piss-away the profits of one department to prop-up another. Sound business sense would say that a failing, but previously successful, department should certainly be given the necessary resources to rediscover what made it great - but after a certain point that amounts to throwing good money after bad, and the failing department needs to be closed down.

I believe that everything my arguments need to stand have been stated. If anything is unclear to you, please ask. If you wish to disagree, please do so - though without suggesting that I have committed an embarrassing failure of logic. It's a little bit rude.

Apart from hurting a bit your ego by suggesting a mistake in what you said i don't think there was something rude in what i said. Everyone might make a mistake, if even the possibility of making a mistake tinkers you that much, sorry but it is not my problem really.

Also by dropping the console space they would indirectly hurt their mobile offerings too, it would only be a step away of doing what Sega did, so my guess is that they would do that only if things got really desperate for them financially.

(10-20-2013, 09:58 PM)Link_to_the_past Wrote: [ -> ]Apart from hurting a bit your ego by suggesting a mistake in what you said i don't think there was something rude in what i said. Everyone might make a mistake, if even the possibility of making a mistake tinkers you that much, sorry but it is not my problem really.

Also by dropping the console space they would indirectly hurt their mobile offerings too, it would only be a step away of doing what Sega did, so my guess is that they would do that only if things got really desperate for them financially.

It comes across rudely. If you didn't mean it rudely, I'm pleased to hear that... one of the reasons I've taken to this board is because it isn't a snot-nosed, shit-flinging free-for-all like so many gaming communities. A bit of good-natured banter's fine - I'll engage in that myself - but I took against your description of my purported mistake. Which, had it actually been a mistake, I would have been entirely willing to recognise and discuss. The nature of my career keeps my ego in very good check, believe me.

But back to the point... I don't think that the U is doing very much for the DS. I see what you're saying (or what I think you're saying), that the profile of Nintendo as a hardware and software manufacturer is emboldened in some repsects by having a presence in the home console space - but Apple are doing very nicely with their iOS devices even among people who don't own (and would never buy) a Mac, and I don't think the DS-side of Nintendo's business would implode if they stopped making home consoles.

Nonetheless, it's a worthy point.

Ironically, after running the Wii U into the ground on this thread last week, I've suddenly found myself playing with it over the past couple of days. In an arse-about-face fashion, I actually have Dolphin to thank for this - although Metroid Prime and The Wind Waker are emulated well through Dolphin, it made me remember how much I loved these games, and made me want to play them again without (no criticism intended) the foibles of emulation.

So, on Monday I bought Metroid Prime: Trilogy and Metroid: Other M for the Wii. And yesterday night I downloaded The Wind Waker HD (for fifty fucking quid... Jesus, Nintendo...). I'm really looking forward to having some fun with these games in the coming weeks.