(07-10-2013, 09:26 PM)lamedude Wrote: [ -> ]My 2¢ is the desktop is getting the bottom of the barrel CPUs with Haswell. Intel doesn't want returns because people can't get their free 400MHZ.
Yep. And if they actually cared about the enthusiasts who bought the K skus, they'd get rid of those crappy lids and expose the CPU die. 20C is kind of a big deal when you're overclocking. AMD remains the enthusiast's choice IMHO. They just lack the technology <sigh>
OP: get a Haswell K series and one of the boards mentioned or an Ivy K series and keep your current board (assuming it is Z77) plus this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835103099
You can then bump your OC as needed to attain the performance you desire and not have to swap out hardware along the way. Haswell only offers about 5-10% performance increase over Ivy, and arguably may not overclock as well as Ivy. So I'd do the budget math, especially if you have a Z77 already.
Zach Wrote:How much of a difference does LLE audio make on performance?
And is it negligible? Or should I use it?
Depends on the game. In some games it has very little impact on performance in other games it's huge. In some games HLE runs fine with no problems. In other games minor or major issues arise if you don't use LLE. It all depends on the game.
Zach Wrote:I can do without fullspeed if it isn't too noticeable. As in, a drop of 10 or more FPS I guess, would be something I'm not okay with. As long as it's nothing detrimental as far as speed goes, I'm okay with a small decrease in speed.
For a LP you really should strive for fullspeed. Slowdowns are very annoying to watch.
Zach Wrote:I'm looking at recording lp's as well, so I guess I should probably deduct a few FPS for that if I use Camstudio/tasia/Fraps/etc, huh?
Yes. Those will reduce your framerate.
Zach Wrote:I don't think overclocking is supported on my mobo.
It would help if we knew what mobo you had.
Zach Wrote:Kind of off-topic I think, but would GHz make a difference in speed? As in, a 4.2 i5 vs a 3.9 i5. Because the i5 2500k is one of the suggested model CPUs, and I was told mine was an upgrade of that model, but without the OC. So I didn't really know what range to look at when I picked my CPU out, and the tech guy said it should do the trick.
1. That's a 300MHz difference not 1GHz.
2. Yes a 1GHz OC will make a big difference.
3. Yes your cpu is an ivy bridge cpu, which is newer. But your model has a lower clock rate than a 2500K and less room to OC.
AnyOldName3 Wrote:I think the general consensus for TLS is one of the following:
2500K/2600K @ 4.6 GHz
3570K/3770K @ 4.3 GHz
4670K/4770K @ 4.1 GHz
As your chip isn't clocked as high as the recommended amount for its generation, you won't get fullspeed.
If the WW benchmark is anything to go by haswell is 30% faster in IPC compared to sandy bridge and ivy bridge is 0% faster.
Which puts them numbers at 4.0, 4.6, and 4.6 respectively.
lamedude Wrote:My 2¢ is the desktop is getting the bottom of the barrel CPUs with Haswell. Intel doesn't want returns because people can't get their free 400MHz.
It could be. Either that or too many people were ok with the 400MHz OC and not buying the more expensive K editions. So they thought they could make more money this way.
rokclimb15 Wrote:And if they actually cared about the enthusiasts who bought the K skus, they'd get rid of those crappy lids and expose the CPU die.
That introduces an extremely high risk of damaging the cpu, especially with a large heavy HSF on it. Which is why neither AMD or Intel will do it with any system where the cooling unit is installed by an end user.
The main reason ivy bridge and haswell have poor thermals compared to sandy bridge is the cheap TIM that they use between the IHS and the die. Not the IHS itself. The low surface area of the die compared the IHS results in very little reduction in thermal dissipation from using the IHS as long as it's properly soldered to the die.
rokclimb15 Wrote:Haswell only offers about 5-10% performance increase over Ivy, and arguably may not overclock as well as Ivy.
In dolphin it can reach the same clock rates and holds a 20-30% advantage over ivy bridge at the same clock rates. So it's a big deal.
(07-11-2013, 07:52 AM)NaturalViolence Wrote: [ -> ]That introduces an extremely high risk of damaging the cpu, especially with a large heavy HSF on it. Which is why neither AMD or Intel will do it with any system where the cooling unit is installed by an end user.
Your point is good, and taken. This used to happen with older CPUs as well when dies were still exposed. However, I've never had it happen to me in 50+ builds. Did heatsinks just get gigantic or are they trying to cover all bases? I mean it was a risk, but never substantial if you applied the heatsink with care.
(07-11-2013, 07:52 AM)NaturalViolence Wrote: [ -> ]In dolphin it can reach the same clock rates and holds a 20-30% advantage over ivy bridge at the same clock rates. So it's a big deal.
That is a big deal!
It's a Gigabyte mobo. B75. According to what I'm reading, it's not overclockable. Or rather, it's not ADVISED.
So, new processor and mobo, just new processor, or what?
Forgive my stupidity. Just had this thing built, and it seems already I have to replace more stuff. Already bought a new graphics card, too...
I'll probably just test it for a bit. Still waiting on the GPU to come in, once it does, I'll install it, see what runs, and give ya'll an update. What exactly is a Haswell CPU? Like, can I get an Intel CPU, with the advantages of an Haswell? Does it work like an EVGA Nvidia vs another Nvidia. Is Haswell just the maker or whatever? Because I am dead confused on this.
Forgive my nubity. And sorry for the endless barrage of questions. I am reading your responses. Just trying to figure out what the Hell all this is...
So, an i7 4770k looks to be one of the best. Can I get that as a Haswell, or is it just Intel?
(07-11-2013, 11:32 AM)Zach Wrote: [ -> ]It's a Gigabyte mobo. B75. According to what I'm reading, it's not overclockable. Or rather, it's not ADVISED.
So, new processor and mobo, just new processor, or what?
Forgive my stupidity. Just had this thing built, and it seems already I have to replace more stuff. Already bought a new graphics card, too...
I'll probably just test it for a bit. Still waiting on the GPU to come in, once it does, I'll install it, see what runs, and give ya'll an update. What exactly is a Haswell CPU? Like, can I get an Intel CPU, with the advantages of an Haswell? Does it work like an EVGA Nvidia vs another Nvidia. Is Haswell just the maker or whatever? Because I am dead confused on this.
Forgive my nubity. And sorry for the endless barrage of questions. I am reading your responses. Just trying to figure out what the Hell all this is...
So, an i7 4770k looks to be one of the best. Can I get that as a Haswell, or is it just Intel?
B75 is a no-go for a stable overclock.
Haswell is the 4th generation of Intel i-series CPUs. 1st gen is just called ix (i3, i5, i7) or sometimes referred to as "Core". 2nd gen was codenamed Sandy Bridge. 3rd gen was codenamed Ivy Bridge (that's what you have). 4th gen is codenamed Haswell.
Latest gen = more power, but each gen changed socket types, so you need a new motherboard to get it. Yours won't overclock anyway. I'd get a new mobo and CPU if your current one isn't cutting it with your desired settings.
i7-4xxx is a Haswell. The first digit after the series notation is the generation. I'd skip the i7 if you primarily intend to run Dolphin or other games and save the bling. i7 has hyperthreading so you can use 8 cores. Dolphin will only use at most 3, and most games won't go beyond 4.
B75 mobo works with Ivy Bridge CPU , it doesn't work with Haswell CPU
Quote:an i7 4770k looks to be one of the best.
Not for Dolphin which is a dual core application , i7's Hyperthreading doesn't matter . i5 4670k + Z87 mobo are good enough
Quote:What exactly is a Haswell CPU?
Codename of 4th generation Intel Core I series i5/i7 4xxx , mobo : B85 , H87 , Z87
Ivy Bridge is codename of 3rd gen Intel Core I series i3/i5/i7 3xxx , mobo : B75 , H77 , Z75 , Z77
Sandy Bridge is codename of 2nd gen Intel Core I series i3/i5/i7 2xxx , mobo : H61 , H67 , P67 , Z68
Nehalem is codename of 1st gen Intel Core I series i3/i5/i7 xxx , mobo : H55 , H57 , Q57 , P55
Any mobo has "Z" or "P" = support overclocking
rokclimb15 Wrote:This used to happen with older CPUs as well when dies were still exposed. However, I've never had it happen to me in 50+ builds. Did heatsinks just get gigantic or are they trying to cover all bases? I mean it was a risk, but never substantial if you applied the heatsink with care.
Back then:
1. Cooling units weren't typically installed by end users.
2. We didn't have the big heavy monstrosities that we have today since cooling requirements were extremely minimal. As a result very little pressure was applied to the cpu.
3. CPU dies had a thicker and stronger insulation layer around them.
hell321 Wrote:haswell cpu quality worse than ivy and sandy cpu quality when overclock hardware review news!
ur info http://www.extremetech.com/computing/152...wer-issues
overclock haswell cpu issue and problem http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/382267/intel...n-expected
Your articles are about TDP, which is only one aspect of cpu quality (and a minor one for desktop cpus). The 20-30% increase in IPC he will receive from haswell will easily outweigh any reduction in maximum clock rate. Our forum members who have haswell cpus have all been able to reach ivy bridge level overclocks easily and with much better performance.
You would know this if you read through the thread before posting.
hell321 Wrote:one thing you are wrong dolphin use 2- 3 core but when testing intensive game it use 4 core
If you're seeing 4 cores under heavy load it's because you have background tasks eating up cpu load. Dolphin won't use more than 3 cores significantly no matter what game you run. It's not programmed to.
hell321 Wrote:just wait for next gen cpu
That's two years away.
hell321 Wrote:haswell cpu expensive
It's barely more expensive than ivy bridge.
hell321 Wrote:want good go for amd fx 8350 8mb cache and asus motherboard the rest of money spend graphic card , cooler , ssd etc....
for pc gamer and emulation and mmorpg
That would be a significant downgrade from what he has now. Ivy bridge is much better for PC gaming and emulation than vishera.
