Hello All
I registered this account for the express purpose of getting some help with performance issues using Dolphin 3.5 x64.
So to start off, here's a brief summary of my system specs.
<<< System Summary >>>
> Mainboard : Gigabyte GA-970A-D3
> Processor : AMD Phenom II X6 1090T @ 4000 MHz
> Physical Memory : 8192 KBDDR3-SDRAM
> Video Card : NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680
> Hard Disk : SAMSUNG HD321KJ ATA Device (320GB)
> Hard Disk : Western Digital WD1002FAEX-00Z3A0 ATA Device (1000GB)
So the issue I'm having is that basically no matter what the settings I have in both Xenoblade and The Last Story, I seem to suffer some massive slowdowns. I'm unsure why this happens because whats being rendered on screen doesn't seem that stressing to what my computer usually has to do, but it suffers massively in terms of performance none the less.
Now, I have heard that emulators dislike AMD CPU's with some sort of unholy vengeance due to the whole SSE thing. So I'm wondering if thats the issue. I'd just like some confirmation that yes, I would be experiencing issues with my setup. Because a quick overview of the forum suggests that I really shouldn't be having to many problems.
Example of performance drop: 30FPS, and then suddenly hits 18FPS in the first corridor of The Last Story.
So folks, any idea's?
You have a CPU bottleneck. With The Last Story, it's one of the most CPU intensive games you can run in Dolphin atm. Your CPU isn't strong enough to run it fullspeed all of the time. You'll need a Sandy or Ivy Bridge chip (probably OCed no less) to run that game constantly at 30 FPS (especially Lazuli City or whatever, the main town you know).
SSE instructions have little to do with the performance gap between Intel and AMD CPUs in Dolphin. Intel's latest CPUs just have a higher single-thread IPC than AMD's offerings, and that's the kind of performance Dolphin relies on.
Quote:Now, I have heard that emulators dislike AMD CPU's
where did you hear that ? That's not true
Quote:"Intel's latest CPUs just have a higher single-thread IPC than AMD's offerings"
This
Dolphin is a dual core application . AMD latest 6-8 cores or Intel 6 cores are useless for Dolphin
Dolphin favors single threaded performance .
Which CPU is the best for Dolphin ? Check
Dolphin benchmark
(04-15-2013, 10:05 AM)admin89 Wrote: [ -> ]Quote:Now, I have heard that emulators dislike AMD CPU's
where did you hear that ? That's not true
Quote:"Intel's latest CPUs just have a higher single-thread IPC than AMD's offerings"
This
Dolphin is a dual core application . AMD latest 6-8 cores or Intel 6 cores are useless for Dolphin
Dolphin favors single threaded performance .
Which CPU is the best for Dolphin ? Check Dolphin benchmark
Heard about latest emulator's disliking AMD from when I was active on the PCSX2 forums. Apperently they don't support AMD CPU's because they aren't compatible with the latest SSE's or something.
As for the dual core thing. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression the clock speed related to the individual clock speed of each CPU. So 4.0ghz would be the clock speed of each of my 6 CPU's. Thus meaning if a program ran with all 6 CPU's threaded, I would have 25.0ghz of processing power at its disposal. Because most programs do not run with anything more then 2 cores threaded though, it only has 8.0ghz available.
So when I'm playing my Dolphin, I am running on only two cores right? So it should be using 8.0ghz. This means it should be the exact same clock speed as someone running a dual or quad core at 4.0, its just I have several other cores to use if they can be.
This thread seems to support my thoughts.
http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/269273...speed-core
If that is all correct. Then why is it an i5 4.0ghz can run everything at full spec, but a 6 core with the same clock speed, and each core running at the same speed as an i5, cannot. It would suggest the problem isn't speed per core, but something else.
(04-15-2013, 02:32 PM)Selvec Wrote: [ -> ]Thus meaning if a program ran with all 6 CPU's threaded, I would have 25.0ghz of processing power at its disposal. Because most programs do not run with anything more then 2 cores threaded though, it only has 8.0ghz available.
If I understand you correctly then no you are wrong. Cores do not stack you simply have two or more threads running at 4Ghz each.
(04-15-2013, 02:32 PM)Selvec Wrote: [ -> ]Then why is it an i5 4.0ghz can run everything at full spec, but a 6 core with the same clock speed, and each core running at the same speed as an i5, cannot. It would suggest the problem isn't speed per core, but something else.
Ghz is not a good measurement of performance. Hertz are a measurement of frequency. 1 hz is 1 cycle per second and that is always true. However CPUs can do different amounts of work in each cycle. Intel is quite a bit beyond AMD in this area. Hertz are only good for gauging relative performance between CPUs of the same family.
Quote: Apperently they don't support AMD CPU's because they aren't compatible with the latest SSE's or something.
Such stupid statement i've ever heard . That person has no clue whatsoever
Why latest AMD fail ? Why people call their Bulldozer as "Faildozer" :
Bulldozer & Piledriver multi-threaded performance does beat i5 2500k and i5 3570k . However , their single threaded performance is way below their previous generation - Phenom II clock for clock
For Example :
+Phenom II x4 980BE @ 3.7GHz vs AMD 8150 x8 @ 3.6GHz(with turbo core up to 4.2GHz)
Only use "Cinebench R10 - Single Threaded Benchmark"
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/362?vs=434
AMD 8150 has higher frequency than Phenom II 980 but still be beaten by Phenom II
+Phenom II x4 980BE @ 3.7GHz vs AMD 8350 x8 @ 4.0GHz(with turbo core up to 4.2GHz)
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/362?vs=697
See . Neck to neck . Please note that 8350 has higher frequency
+How does Phenom II fare with latest Intel i3 3220 x2 @ 3.3GHz in single threaded performance ? See :
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/362?vs=677
i3 beat it by a large margin
Starcraft 2 is also a dual core application . Starcraft 2 benchmark result should be useful for Dolphin
Quote:Thus meaning if a program ran with all 6 CPU's threaded, I would have 25.0ghz of processing power at its disposal. Because most programs do not run with anything more then 2 cores threaded though, it only has 8.0ghz available.
So when I'm playing my Dolphin, I am running on only two cores right? So it should be using 8.0ghz.
Nope , you're entirely wrong . A CPU frequency does not change like that . 4.0GHz CPU is 4.0GHz CPU , 8.0GHz CPU is 8.0GHz CPU
Selvec Wrote:Apperently they don't support AMD CPU's because they aren't compatible with the latest SSE's or something.
That sentence doesn't make any sense. AMD CPUs support SSE too. And PCSX2 supports AMD cpus. Can you please link the thread or blog post that you're referring to so we can all figure out what you're trying to say?
The closest fact I can think of that you might be referring to is that certain SSE instructions from recent extensions may not work on certain AMD cpus. Perhaps for example PCSX2 makes use of SSE4 or SSSE3 instructions which are not supported by phenom II cpus. Regardless of this fact whether or not you use the latest SSE instructions at all in your code an i5 cpu is still going to stomp all over a phenom II no matter what type of workload you give it.
Selvec Wrote:Then why is it an i5 4.0ghz can run everything at full spec, but a 6
core with the same clock speed, and each core running at the same speed
as an i5, cannot. It would suggest the problem isn't speed per core, but
something else.
They're completely different architectures. These are electronic devices that consist of 600 million to 1.2 billion nanoscopic electronic components comprimising 3 dimensional circuits manufactured onto a piece of silicon roughly the size of your fingernail. You can't reduce these things down to clock rate and core count. These are specs used for marketing purposes. They don't paint the whole picture. That's the short answer anyways. If you would like to learn more about the subject I can certainly write a longer explanation if you're interested.
I assure you emulators don't have some magic vendetta against AMD cpus. Phenom II cpus are just inferior chips compared to modern Intel cpus. There is nothing the developers can do that could possibly make a modern emulator run faster on a phenom II than a sandy bridge i5.
And for the record AMDs bulldozer and piledriver microarchitectures now support all of the SSE extensions that Intel supports plus a few extra ones that Intel doesn't yet support. So it's really only older AMD cpus such as yours that don't support up to date SSE extensions. Once again, not a vendetta against AMD cpus.
Also Xalphenos's explanation is a perfect summary of why your "GHz math" doesn't make sense. Like he said hertz is a unit of measurement for frequency. It is not a unit of measurement for speed or processing power. The two are related. But not directly or in a linear way.
admin89 Wrote:Such stupid statement i've ever heard . That person has no clue whatsoever
There is no need to insult him. He's either ignorant of the facts or not correctly phrasing his point due to ignorance of terminology. Neither of which is a crime. And neither of which makes him stupid. You can just point out the facts to him and explain why he's wrong or ask him to elaborate and link to his source.
I never intent to insult anyone nor i want to start a flame war . But if you feel it that way then i'm sorry
Hai, saw this post and I have similar a similar spec, after hours of tweaking and overclocking I still couldnt get Xenoblade as high as 30fps in battles, my CPU is at 4.0 GHz OC and im getting around 20-27 FPS so its not that bad.
Just wish I bought an intel now :<
(05-20-2013, 06:55 AM)demonist Wrote: [ -> ]Hai, saw this post and I have similar a similar spec, after hours of tweaking and overclocking I still couldnt get Xenoblade as high as 30fps in battles, my CPU is at 4.0 GHz OC and im getting around 20-27 FPS so its not that bad.
Just wish I bought an intel now :<
yours should easily be able to do 4.5 if you keep the temps down.
and i know your feelings. before i had a phenom II x4 955 @ 4ghz. it sure ran things great but then when i decided to start doing gamecube & ps2 emulation it just showed how far behind amd really is. and theres only 1 actual pc game that shows how weak it is imo (Planetside 2). but you cant compare them apples to apples. different beasts.
just try pushing a little more out of your processor if you can.