Here is the deal I have a i7 960 and tried to run Fire Emblem 9 (a gamecube game) with LLE sound, but sound is heavily skipping. I overclocked it to 4.0GHz, but same story, sound skips too often to be playable. Now while it appears the i7-9xx line doesnt have the muscles, the question is, is there a CPU capable of doing such a task at all? Newer CPU's arent that much better from what i heard. I could overclock mine to 4.3GHz, and the 3770k would be about 4.8k so not really a difference.
Does the 3770k is able to render, say Xenoblade@60fps and LLE sound without skipping?
I would upgrade, but it would be pointless if the new cpu isnt capable to run all things anyway as aside from LLE sound im fine with my CPUs performance even at stock speeds, so could wait for faster cpus appearing on the market no problem.
3570k/3770k :
- full speed + LLE in most games? Sure
- constantly without speed drops or sound skipping? Maybe not
"maybe" means not. Thanks, i suspected as much. Although HLE is really tearing my ears off.
Why do you need LLE in path of radiance ? I didnt notice any problems with HLE.
As for your question about cpu,newer cpus such as i5 3570k is faster then yours at the same speed,and can even be overclocked higher.
Overclocked 3570k or 3770k will run all games fullspeed even with LLE,except maybe Last Story but lle is not required for that game.
It will run xenoblade fullspeed without sound skipping,but only at 30 or 25 fps because some games cant run at 60 fps because they were not made that way.
You could run them at 60 fps when you disable framelimit but everything in game would appear too fast.
And waiting won't do you much good either. Nothing will be able to do this for a few years, and maybe not even then, as microprocessor development is hitting new bottlenecks. Either way, we definately won't have something which will run dolphin in interpreter mode wit LLE that uses modern technology.
@rpglord
Music is frequently disappearing with HLE and general weirdness random noises and general audio quality issues, the difference is like between mp3@128kbps and CD audio and lots of missing effects like chat clicking actually has a slight echo to it with LLE etc. HLE does not exactly stand for quality.
@AnyOldName3
JIT mode, if it means what it means, is actually interpreter. Thats how Java boosted its performance. Not sure what you mean, The Last Story hits the limits of Wii pretty hard already, so there will be no more demanding games, IF the 3770k is not able to handle it, the next gen cpu most certainly will.
(09-14-2012, 10:56 AM)ncknck Wrote: [ -> ]@AnyOldName3
JIT mode, if it means what it means, is actually interpreter. Thats how Java boosted its performance. Not sure what you mean, The Last Story hits the limits of Wii pretty hard already, so there will be no more demanding games, IF the 3770k is not able to handle it, the next gen cpu most certainly will.
Um, what? JIT = Just in Time
Recompiler, not Interpreter. That means it is taking the binary code and converting that into local machine code. In Java, this means it is taking the Java Bytecode and recompiling it into machine code, and in Dolphin this means it is taking Wii machine code and converting it to Intel x86 machine code. The interpreter in Dolphin is literally looking at the code, figuring out what it wants to do, and then executing it using Dolphin's own program. The recompilers, on the other hand, take the binary code and convert it to binary directly. It is different.
Anyway, my 3570K @ 4.4 GHz doesn't stutter at all on Super Mario Galaxy 1/2 with LLE, and those games are almost as demanding as The Last Story with EFB -> RAM but without LLE. I'm confident that if you really wanted to run just about any game full speed with the JIT or JITIL recompilers you would be able to do so by overclocking an Intel Extreme series chip enough. Until we get some brand new chip technology, running The Last Story with HLE and everything else with LLE is really the only option right now.
I agree ofc, my point being that running pure interpreters for the sake of running pure interpreters is not a productive task.
The interpreter in Dolphin actually does serve some purpose, as it is the only way to emulate a handful of games.
ncknck Wrote:Here is the deal I have a i7 960 and tried to run Fire Emblem 9 (a gamecube game) with LLE sound, but sound is heavily skipping. I overclocked it to 4.0GHz, but same story, sound skips too often to be playable. Now while it appears the i7-9xx line doesnt have the muscles, the question is, is there a CPU capable of doing such a task at all? Newer CPU's arent that much better from what i heard. I could overclock mine to 4.3GHz, and the 3770k would be about 4.8k so not really a difference.
Does the 3770k is able to render, say Xenoblade@60fps and LLE sound without skipping?
I would upgrade, but it would be pointless if the new cpu isnt capable to run all things anyway as aside from LLE sound im fine with my CPUs performance even at stock speeds, so could wait for faster cpus appearing on the market no problem.
Actually newer cpus are quite a bit faster. I would expect a sandy bridge cpu at 4.8GHz to deliver somewhere between 40-50% better performance. How fast is it running on your current cpu?
AnyOldName3 Wrote:And waiting won't do you much good either. Nothing will be able to do this for a few years, and maybe not even then, as microprocessor development is hitting new bottlenecks. Either way, we definately won't have something which will run dolphin in interpreter mode wit LLE that uses modern technology.
I keep expecting single threaded performance to stop improving or at least slow down but Intel keeps proving me wrong. Sandy bridge for example improved single threaded performance by 50% in many applications over Nehalem. That's a much higher improvement than the switch from core(2) to Nehalem produced. Over the last 8 years for x86 cpus single threaded performance has improved about 22% per year pretty consistently. We don't really know if that will stop soon but based on what we know about Haswell so far it looks like it will continue the trend.
Also why did you bring up the interpreter?
ncknck Wrote:JIT mode, if it means what it means, is actually interpreter. Thats how Java boosted its performance. Not sure what you mean, The Last Story hits the limits of Wii pretty hard already, so there will be no more demanding games, IF the 3770k is not able to handle it, the next gen cpu most certainly will.
You don't know the first thing about emulation do you? Nearly everything you just said is wrong, I'm not even going to bother picking it apart unless you really want me to.
Axxer Wrote:Um, what? JIT = Just in Time Recompiler, not Interpreter. That means it is taking the binary code and converting that into local machine code. In Java, this means it is taking the Java Bytecode and recompiling it into machine code, and in Dolphin this means it is taking Wii machine code and converting it to Intel x86 machine code. The interpreter in Dolphin is literally looking at the code, figuring out what it wants to do, and then executing it using Dolphin's own program. The recompilers, on the other hand, take the binary code and convert it to binary directly. It is different.
Anyway, my 3570K @ 4.4 GHz doesn't stutter at all on Super Mario Galaxy 1/2 with LLE, and those games are almost as demanding as The Last Story with EFB -> RAM but without LLE. I'm confident that if you really wanted to run just about any game full speed with the JIT or JITIL recompilers you would be able to do so by overclocking an Intel Extreme series chip enough. Until we get some brand new chip technology, running The Last Story with HLE and everything else with LLE is really the only option right now.
I object to using the term 'binary code' to refer to machine code. All information and programming in a computer is binary code, all of it. I also don't know what "Dolphin's own program" is supposed to mean.
Interpreters process instructions one at a time by calling functions that produce the same behavior.
JIT Recompilers process instructions in blocks separated by jump or call/returnp instructions. They're way more complex. First a block of source code is parsed one instruction at a time, for each instruction it calls a function that emits native machine code into a cache that will produce similar behavior. After the block has been translated it parses the translated block and begins optimizing it based on runtime information. Afterwards it steps through the instructions in the cache one at a time executing them. All kinds of other stuff may or may not happen. Cache blocks sometimes have to be invalidated/deleted for various reasons. Sometimes it may have to fall back on the interpreter if certain circumstances are encountered. And so on.....
Axxer Wrote:The interpreter in Dolphin actually does serve some purpose, as it is the only way to emulate a handful of games.
It's also useful for debugging.