Dolphin, the GameCube and Wii emulator - Forums

You may be right then, I'll look into it a little further, and see what I come up with. For now, I'll change i5 to i7 in my actual post to make it legit. The primary point of what I was saying was that AMD doesn't have the complex core capabilities of Intel, and the Phenom II Quad Core won't pull as much weight as a Hyperthreaded Intel.

Every once and awhile while skimming through the threads on this forum that have already been answered my eye glimpses a statement so profoundly stupid I am forced to rest my head for awhile to recover from the intense mental pain that reading it inflicts on me. Then I must respond to it. This my friends, is one of those threads.

Quote:The reason you're probably getting low FPS isn't because your CPU isn't fast enough -- the Phenom II's are rather peppy -- it's because your CPU has only 4 logical threads. Dolphin makes use of two cores, which makes Intel chips ideal; specifically the i5 and i7 because of the complex core technology.

True.

Quote:These chips (like my own i5 2500k) have 2 logical threads per core,

.....uh.....no it doesn't.

Quote: effectively allowing 4 core processing on the two core allowance from Dolphin.

*Stares in utter disbelief.*
No it doesn't. You must have absolutely no idea how multithreaded programming or HT work in order to make a statement like that.

Quote:I was saying that Dolphin may use 2 PHYSICAL threads (CORES), but there are two LOGICAL threads per CORE.

True but dolphin cannot use 4 logical cores/threads. Dolphin only has 2-3 major threads. Each thread maps to 1 logical core regardless of how many you have. HT does not magically increase the number of threads an application has. HT simply allows two threads to be processed simultaneously by the same core, effectively allowing the cpu to run twice as many application threads in parallel.

Quote:I'm not saying that Intel allows Dolphin the use of 4 cores, it allows the use of 2 complex, or the simulated likeness of 4 cores.

I can't even figure out what you're trying to say here. What the hell does "simulated likeness" mean? Please use proper terminology.

Quote:Dolphin doesn't want to agree with you.

Quote:Says Hyperthreading Enabled right on it.

It's a bug. Look up the 2500K on intel.com if you don't believe us.

Quote:I don't mean to get hostile, just please accept my advice when I have it, and please send me a PM if you have a problem with something I say in the future so it can stay out of the forums, cool?

No. In an ideal world this should never happen. If someone has the arrogance to post BS and start talking about things they know nothing about as if they have a greater understanding of the subject material they should be called out on their BS in public so that everyone else can laugh at them. That way they will hopefully feel bad about it and learn to be more careful in the future.

When you post BS in close proximity to people who are knowledgeable about the subject material those people tend to try and correct you. If you then try to form a counterargument without reliable evidence those people tend to get extremely pissed. I'm surprised you didn't expect this.

Quote:The primary point of what I was saying was that AMD doesn't have the complex core capabilities of Intel, and the Phenom II Quad Core won't pull as much weight as a Hyperthreaded Intel.

Hyperthreading makes no difference to dolphin whatsoever.

Here, have some reading material (post #101): http://forums.dolphin-emu.org/showthread.php?tid=20573&page=11

Now to answer the OPs VERY SIMPLE QUESTIONS which I am astounded none of you tried to answer:

Quote:Ill try but my current temp when running crysis demo peaks at around 50 degrees. Is that too high??

No. That's actually quite low for a cpu. However crysis won't put your cpu under high/full load. Try taking your temperatures while running a game in dolphin.

Quote:Also to clarify, OC will constantly cAuse blue screens? Or just when forst setting it and finding a stable result??

Not if you know what you're doing.

To quote what ExtremeDude2 would say: This ^^

(04-10-2012, 01:08 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote: [ -> ]Every once and awhile while skimming through the threads on this forum that have already been answered my eye glimpses a statement so profoundly stupid I am forced to rest my head for awhile to recover from the intense mental pain that reading it inflicts on me. Then I must respond to it. This my friends, is one of those threads.

Quote:The reason you're probably getting low FPS isn't because your CPU isn't fast enough -- the Phenom II's are rather peppy -- it's because your CPU has only 4 logical threads. Dolphin makes use of two cores, which makes Intel chips ideal; specifically the i5 and i7 because of the complex core technology.

True.

Quote:These chips (like my own i5 2500k) have 2 logical threads per core,

.....uh.....no it doesn't.

Quote: effectively allowing 4 core processing on the two core allowance from Dolphin.

*Stares in utter disbelief.*
No it doesn't. You must have absolutely no idea how multithreaded programming or HT work in order to make a statement like that.

Quote:I was saying that Dolphin may use 2 PHYSICAL threads (CORES), but there are two LOGICAL threads per CORE.

True but dolphin cannot use 4 logical cores/threads. Dolphin only has 2-3 major threads. Each thread maps to 1 logical core regardless of how many you have. HT does not magically increase the number of threads an application has. HT simply allows two threads to be processed simultaneously by the same core, effectively allowing the cpu to run twice as many application threads in parallel.

Quote:I'm not saying that Intel allows Dolphin the use of 4 cores, it allows the use of 2 complex, or the simulated likeness of 4 cores.

I can't even figure out what you're trying to say here. What the hell does "simulated likeness" mean? Please use proper terminology.

Quote:Dolphin doesn't want to agree with you.

Quote:Says Hyperthreading Enabled right on it.

It's a bug. Look up the 2500K on intel.com if you don't believe us.

Quote:I don't mean to get hostile, just please accept my advice when I have it, and please send me a PM if you have a problem with something I say in the future so it can stay out of the forums, cool?

No. In an ideal world this should never happen. If someone has the arrogance to post BS and start talking about things they know nothing about as if they have a greater understanding of the subject material they should be called out on their BS in public so that everyone else can laugh at them. That way they will hopefully feel bad about it and learn to be more careful in the future.

When you post BS in close proximity to people who are knowledgeable about the subject material those people tend to try and correct you. If you then try to form a counterargument without reliable evidence those people tend to get extremely pissed. I'm surprised you didn't expect this.

Quote:The primary point of what I was saying was that AMD doesn't have the complex core capabilities of Intel, and the Phenom II Quad Core won't pull as much weight as a Hyperthreaded Intel.

Hyperthreading makes no difference to dolphin whatsoever.

Here, have some reading material (post #101): http://forums.dolphin-emu.org/showthread.php?tid=20573&page=11

Now to answer the OPs VERY SIMPLE QUESTIONS which I am astounded none of you tried to answer:

Quote:Ill try but my current temp when running crysis demo peaks at around 50 degrees. Is that too high??

No. That's actually quite low for a cpu. However crysis won't put your cpu under high/full load. Try taking your temperatures while running a game in dolphin.

Quote:Also to clarify, OC will constantly cAuse blue screens? Or just when forst setting it and finding a stable result??

Not if you know what you're doing.

See thats what I was wondering. I looked up what a logical core is and it is just a thread. I have experience in programming and intel cna't divide your program into 4 threads for you without screwing up the whole application. It has to be coded for more cores/threads so that it can support them. What intel seems to have mote of is cache as far as i know. And comparig a i-2500k to a x4 955 isn't fair since there is a 120 dollar difference plus i-2500k is almost a 8 core so you would have to compare to a 8 core amd processor.

As fpr temperature, i thought 50 was highest but everyone here is saying 60. Ill check tomorrow to see the temperature it runs dolphin at. Ill probably just edit this post here but if dolpin only uses 2 cores then it shouldn't be much higher cause last i remember, crysis uses 4 cores but that might be 2 not 1

(04-11-2012, 12:09 PM)Ihaa Wrote: [ -> ]See thats what I was wondering. I looked up what a logical core is and it is just a thread. I have experience in programming and intel cna't divide your program into 4 threads for you without screwing up the whole application. It has to be coded for more cores/threads so that it can support them. What intel seems to have mote of is cache as far as i know. And comparig a i-2500k to a x4 955 isn't fair since there is a 120 dollar difference plus i-2500k is almost a 8 core so you would have to compare to a 8 core amd processor.

As fpr temperature, i thought 50 was highest but everyone here is saying 60. Ill check tomorrow to see the temperature it runs dolphin at. Ill probably just edit this post here but if dolpin only uses 2 cores then it shouldn't be much higher cause last i remember, crysis uses 4 cores but that might be 2 not 1

what are you talking about ? I5 2320/2500/2500k is 4cores 4 threads CPU (No Hyper Threading)
See :
http://ark.intel.com/products/52210

I7 2600/2600k/2700k is 4 cores 8threads . Hyper Threading doesn't work with dolphin anyway

Phenom II can't beat Core 2 duo series (2 cores vs 2 cores , Dolphin only uses 2) . Phenom II won't stand a chance against i3 first gen (i3 530)

.....oh dear.....more errors to correct.

Quote:See thats what I was wondering. I looked up what a logical core is and it is just a thread.

No it isn't. Logical cores are basically another term for virtual cores. They are abstract cores created by the OS to handle threading.

Quote:I have experience in programming and intel cna't divide your program into 4 threads for you without screwing up the whole application. It has to be coded for more cores/threads so that it can support them.

Correct.

Quote:What intel seems to have mote of is cache as far as i know.

Nope. Modern intel and amd cpus usually have about the same amount of cache. A 2500K has lass total L3 + l2 cache space than a phenom II 955. Although having a bigger cache does not necessarily improve application performance.

Quote:And comparig a i-2500k to a x4 955 isn't fair since there is a 120 dollar difference

Correct but we're not trying to compare them in performance per dollar (although you seem to be trying to do that for some reason).

Quote: plus i-2500k is almost a 8 core so you would have to compare to a 8 core amd processor.

Uh.....no. They are both quad core cpus. The 2500K doesn't even have HT let alone 8 cores.

Quote:As fpr temperature, i thought 50 was highest but everyone here is saying 60. Ill check tomorrow to see the temperature it runs dolphin at.

*laughs a little bit*

50C and 60C are both quite low for a modern cpu. Call us when it passes 80C, that's when you should start getting worried.

Quote:Ill probably just edit this post here but if dolpin only uses 2 cores then it shouldn't be much higher cause last i remember, crysis uses 4 cores but that might be 2 not 1

Just because crysis uses 4 cores does not mean it produces a constant high load on those 4 cores. Dolphin puts a constant high load on two of your cores while you're playing a game and is likely more demanding on your cpu overall than crysis.

(04-11-2012, 01:47 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote: [ -> ].....oh dear.....more errors to correct.

Quote:See thats what I was wondering. I looked up what a logical core is and it is just a thread.

No it isn't. Logical cores are basically another term for virtual cores. They are abstract cores created by the OS to handle threading.

Quote:I have experience in programming and intel cna't divide your program into 4 threads for you without screwing up the whole application. It has to be coded for more cores/threads so that it can support them.

Correct.

Quote:What intel seems to have mote of is cache as far as i know.

Nope. Modern intel and amd cpus usually have about the same amount of cache. A 2500K has lass total L3 + l2 cache space than a phenom II 955. Although having a bigger cache does not necessarily improve application performance.

Quote:And comparig a i-2500k to a x4 955 isn't fair since there is a 120 dollar difference

Correct but we're not trying to compare them in performance per dollar (although you seem to be trying to do that for some reason).

Quote: plus i-2500k is almost a 8 core so you would have to compare to a 8 core amd processor.

Uh.....no. They are both quad core cpus. The 2500K doesn't even have HT let alone 8 cores.

Quote:As fpr temperature, i thought 50 was highest but everyone here is saying 60. Ill check tomorrow to see the temperature it runs dolphin at.

*laughs a little bit*

50C and 60C are both quite low for a modern cpu. Call us when it passes 80C, that's when you should start getting worried.

Quote:Ill probably just edit this post here but if dolpin only uses 2 cores then it shouldn't be much higher cause last i remember, crysis uses 4 cores but that might be 2 not 1

Just because crysis uses 4 cores does not mean it produces a constant high load on those 4 cores. Dolphin puts a constant high load on two of your cores while you're playing a game and is likely more demanding on your cpu overall than crysis.

Im lost for the virtual cores now XD

Btw I meant to say the intel cpu's with hyper threading not a 2500k sorry about that.

Okay so I tried out donkey kong country returns. The game runs at 30-40 frames per second and the only sound problem i had was at the startup menu for like a split second the rest is normal. The heat produced peaked at around 53.5 degrees but it was roughly 49+ depending on what's happening in the game. The thing is however, that one wall of my pc box is taken off cause its a old box and having it closed makes it hotter so i have one wall open for heat to escape easier. I don't know if thats good or bad but its been working for me.

People generally prefer to have all their case attached as it looks neater, but if it keeps temps down then you can have it off.