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First and last video are also pretty decent.
Got me a salvaged crate :3
Curse you. Tongue
(10-04-2012, 10:34 AM)Xtreme2damax Wrote: [ -> ]Curse you. Tongue

lol wut, you've probably had like 5 of them XD
got s. sapper Big Grin
There is a raffle on backpack.tf that needs more people to join in order to unlock the rest of the items to win.

http://backpack.tf/raffle

Join their Steam group then wait a half hour or so and re-visit the page above to be automatically entered.
So I'm working on a spy guide for MVM. It's almost done but even after hours of research there are still some questions about detection that I can't find answers to. See the unknown section below:

Spy

Ideal loadout:
-L'etranger, Ambassador, or Enforcer
-Butterfly Knife, Sharp Dresser, Black Rose, Spycicle, Big Earner, or Connivers Kunai
-Dead Ringer
-Electrosapper or Red Tape Recorder

Detection:
-Robots detect undisguised spies in their FOV, always wear a disguise or remain cloaked when around robots
-Robots detect spies on fire even if they are in disguise and/or cloaked
-Robots detect bleed even if you are in disguise and/or cloaked
-Robots detect nearby backstabs (up to medium range) really well
-Robots detect nearby attacks from revolvers (up to medium range) really well
-Giant robots detect nearby saps (including on themselves), it may just be that they detect it with only their medics
-Robots detect you if you disguise inside their FOV. Always disguise while cloaked or hidden.
-Robots detect cloak blinking, which happens when you run out of cloak energy with the C&D, take damage, or run into them.

-Robots cannot hear you uncloak or disguise
-Robots cannot detect incorrect movement speeds (it's safe to disguise as a scout)
-Robots cannot distinguish between real deaths and feign deaths (the dead ringer fools them)
-Robots don't care if you cloak/uncloak right in front of them as long as you are wearing a disguise
-Robots will spam the last place they saw you if you cloak without a disguise in front of them, then ignore you and move on
-Regular robots do not detect nearby saps

Multiple robots can react instantly. They can pivot the top half of their body to allow them to shoot behind them while still walking forwards. If a nearby group of robots with ranged weapons (or a single giant) detects you you will be instantly killed.
The robots "back" is the opposite side of whatever direction their top half is facing. It has nothing to do
with what direction they're walking in. If I robot turns around to shoot you, you cannot back stab him
because he is now facing you.

Unknown (requires testing)
-Do robots detect you if you're running the wrong way?
-Do robots detect you if you block their path?
-Do giant robots detect all nearby saps or just when you sap their medics?
-Do they remember you if you cloak after being discovered? I think the answer is yes. If that is the case then you will need to change your disguise after being detected.

I have seen robots detect/attack me for running into them but I'm not sure if it was because I blocked their path or because I was running in the opposite direction of the bomb in their FOV. Clearly the algorithm checks for one of those but I'm not sure which. I think it checks for direction, which means you need to sneak up behind them.

Other Info:
-The Electrosapper is a god tier tool when upgraded but has a very long recharge time which can't be upgraded.
-Ammo Refill canteens instantly recharge your sapper and only cost 25 credits each.
-Ubercharge canteens allow you to chain stab groups of robots after you sap them without fear of retaliation from other groups. They cost 75 credits each. Use them to deal with medics.

Sappers:
-The Electrosapper and the red tape recorder function exactly the same way in mann vs. machine. Therefore it doesn't matter which one you use.
-The Electrosapper disables robots but does not damage them. It slows giant robots.

Revolvers:
-The diamondback doesn't give grits for robots that you destroy with your sapper attached so it's useless.
-The predictable movement patterns and lack of brains makes the robots easy targets for ambassador headshots, especially snipers. This makes the ambassador a straight upgrade from the stock revolver.
-The enforcer is the best revolver for bringing down tanks, especially when crit boosted.
-L'entrager is good for helping you quickly recharge the dead ringer.

Cloak:
The dead ringer is massively better in MVM then the IW or C&D. 90% damage reduction allows you to survive the walls of explosives and bullets that you will inevitably encounter. The short duration and loud uncloak don't matter because the robots can't detect a cloak/uncloak anyways. It doesn't blink, which the robots do detect. It can recharge from ammo kits and dispensers. The feign death fools them. And so on..... It's basically a god mode button that will save your ass constantly, and there is no downside to using it.

Knives:
Nearly every knife is useful. The butterfly knife, black rose, and sharp dresser are all identical other than appearance. The wanga prick and your eternal reward are useless because they take 2 seconds to disguise unlike the normal instant disguise that they get and robots detect nearby back stabs so you'll be dead within those 2 seconds. The spycicle can improve your chances of surviving a pyro encounter but you'll lose your knife for 15 seconds if you get hit. If you do catch fire you can use the dead ringer to put it out. The big earner will help you recharge the dead ringer faster in exchange for losing some health. The Conniver's Kunai cuts your base health in half but lets you heal and overheal up to 180 HP by backstabbing which can improve your odds of surviving long enough to pull out the dead ringer after being detected. But you'll be more vulnerable when not overhealed. All of them have pro/con tradeoffs that make them equally good for MVM (except the wanga prick/your eternal reward).

My preference though is the Conniver's Kunai since it saves me from having to spend credits on "gain health on kill" for my knife. I can use L'etranger to recharge the dead ringer very quickly if I upgrade its firing speed, making the big earner unnecessary. The spycicle rarely saves you and the dead ringer can put out a fire just as easily if it's charged, and without making me lose my knife for 15 seconds. I think the L'etranger and Conniver's Kunai go well together but there are also other combinations that work well.
I'm going to go ahead and post the other loadouts while I'm at it:

Scout
-Force-a-nature or Scattergun
-Mad milk
-Sandman

My Preference: I'm probably leaning towards the scattergun.

Pyro
-Flamethrower or Rainblower
-Flare gun
-Third degree

A crit boosted third degree will instantly kill an entire group of medics with one hit since they're all connected to the giant through their medibeams.

Soldier
-Cow Mangler, Black Box, Beggar's Bazooka, or Direct Hit
-Buff banner, Concheror, or Righteous Bison
-Equalizer

My Preference: Whatever I feel like (except I always use the Buff Banner).

Demoman
-Grenade Launcher, Bootlegger, or Alli Baba's Wee Booties
Preference: Not sure
-Stickybomb Launcher or Scottish Resistance
Preference: Scottish Resistance
-Half-Zatoichi

My Preference: I don't know. I still haven't played demoman on advanced MVM.

Heavy
-Minigun or Brass Beast
-Sandvich or Dalokohs Bar
-Steel Gauntlets, Holiday Punch, or Gloves of Running Urgently

My Preference: Minigun, Sandvich, Gloves of Running Urgently

Engineer
-Frontiers Justice or Widowmaker
-Wrangler or Short Circuit
-Gunslinger or Southern Hospitality

My Preference: Frontiers Justice, Wrangler, Gunslinger


Medic
-Syringe Gun or Crusader's Crossbow
-Medi-gun or Kritzkrieg
-Vita-saw or Ubersaw

My Preference: Syringe Gun, Kritzkrieg, Vita-saw

Sniper
-Huntsman, Sydney Sleeper, Bazaar Bargain, Machina, Hitman's Heatseeker
-Jarate
-Kukri

My Preference: Sydney Sleeper or Huntsman

Spy, demoman, and soldier have a lot of flexible builds that work equally well in different circumstances.
The other classes pretty much have to stick to a semi-specific loadout to maximize effectiveness.
Got a challenge for you guys.

1. Get some Strange Mantreads.

2. Get a Mantreads Kill.

First one to get a kill wins. Rules are simple:

1. Kill must be obtained in normal gameplay, can not be farmed.
can I use non strange? :p
The whole point of using the Strange mantreads is for verification unless you want to make a video or can screencap it.