Dolphin PC buying guide

[dart06]

What kind of results would this PC get for me?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883229283

I would like to run it at 1080p 2X Internal Resolution with 4X SSAA (9X if not too expensive) at full speed.

Primarily for Mario Galaxy 1 & 2 and Skyward Sword. Thanks!

If anyone could give me a list of parts that would be better to build myself, I would also be much appreciative.

[NaturalViolence]

4xSSAA currently does not work, however that graphics card is more than capable of running games at 4x IR. That's a good system for dolphin but building it yourself is always recommended over brand name systems.

[Apollo33]

Does anyone know if they're currently working on quad-core support for Dolphin? If it's technically possible then I imagine that would give everyone a massive improvement.

I was thinking of building a new computer but after reading some of this thread I feel like I should just wait until I'm sure that whatever processor I buy will run everything at 100%.

[NaturalViolence]

Quote:Does anyone know if they're currently working on quad-core support for Dolphin?

No.

Quote:If it's technically possible then I imagine that would give everyone a massive improvement.

You're making an assumption without any evidence. Dolphin only has to emulate 3 chips, and it already splits the emulation of those three chips into three separate threads. Each chip has to be emulated sequentially so it can't be further multithreaded in such a way that would offer any substantial improvement.

[Apollo33]

(11-16-2011, 02:28 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote:

Quote:If it's technically possible then I imagine that would give everyone a massive improvement.

You're making an assumption without any evidence. Dolphin only has to emulate 3 chips, and it already splits the emulation of those three chips into three separate threads. Each chip has to be emulated sequentially so it can't be further multithreaded in such a way that would offer any substantial improvement.

I didn't make an assumption. I said if it's possible to split the emulation up into more parallel computations, then there would be a big improvement with more cores. Thanks for explaining that it's not possible.

So at this point should I wait for Ivy Bridge and see what happens with those chips? I assume they'll be running faster and cooler than the current generation.

[ketchup3821]

Hello all.

I am in the planning stages of a PC-in-a-NES-case that will function as a hybrid HTPC/emulator box. The most demanding thing it will have to do is emulate Wii games (using Dolphin) at 1080p. Obviously something like a i5-2500K would be ideal, but I'd prefer something that runs cooler (and cheaper would be nice as always). I also will need a graphics card that is small and cool-running enough to function in such a limited design. Again, Dolphin emulating Wii at 1080p will be the most demanding thing this computer will ever have to do. Any CPU/GPU suggestions to work within these limitations? I don't have a preference in terms of AMD vs. Intel, or Nvidia vs. ATI. miniITX mobos are available for either.

[NaturalViolence]

Quote:I assume they'll be running faster and cooler than the current generation.

That's not an assumption because Intel has already given us all of the evidence we need to confirm these things. These are facts, not assumptions. Quad core ivy bridge cpus will have a 77w TDP (down from 95w in sandy bridge). Intel has also promised a 20% increase in cpu performance (although we don't know how much of that will come from IPC improvement and how much will come from higher clock rates) and a 60% increase in IGP performance as compared to sandy bridge.

Quote:I didn't make an assumption.

Yes you did. See this:

Quote:I said if it's possible to split the emulation up into more parallel computations, then there would be a big improvement with more cores.

This is an assumption. You have no evidence to suggest that it would significantly improve performance. The word IF doesn't change that statement. For example if I say something like "IF I make this dagger out of iron it won't rust" then I'm making an assumption that goes against evidence even though I used the word if.

Quote:Thanks for explaining that it's not possible.

I didn't say it wasn't possible. I said it wasn't practical (to much work and potential problems for too little possible gain).

Quote:I am in the planning stages of a PC-in-a-NES-case that will function as a hybrid HTPC/emulator box.

Oh that's going to be harder than you think I can promise you that.

Quote: Obviously something like a i5-2500K would be ideal

You want to put an i5 2500k inside an NES case? Do you have any idea how insane that is? Please remove the mere thought of this from your brain at once.

Quote:I also will need a graphics card that is small and cool-running enough to function in such a limited design. Again, Dolphin emulating Wii at 1080p will be the most demanding thing this computer will ever have to do. Any CPU/GPU suggestions to work within these limitations?

Well you haven't really given us any specific limitations. All you've said so far is that you'll be using an NES case. We don't know how you plan to design this, what kind of power supply, how well ventilated the case will be (are you going to cut a hole for a rear fan?), or if you plan on passively cooling everything.

You've mentioned using a miniITX motherboard but do you have the space for a low profile graphics card or will integrated graphics be a requirement? BE SURE, don't assume it. Keep in mind high end integrated graphics processors these days are powerful enough for running dolphin at the native internal resolution (640 x 528), but if you want true HD you'll need a graphics card (although llano might be able to do it with an IGP).

I would seriously reconsider making dolphin a priority for this thing. Dolphin requires top of the line hardware, as I'm sure you realize. Putting top of the line hardware in a system like that just isn't practical (although it is possible, trading dolphin performance away will allow you to use much cheaper parts that produce far less heat).

[ketchup3821]

Quote:
I am in the planning stages of a PC-in-a-NES-case that will function as a hybrid HTPC/emulator box.

Oh that's going to be harder than you think I can promise you that.

I don't think it is going to be easy by any means. But easy projects are no fun.

Quote:
Obviously something like a i5-2500K would be ideal

You want to put an i5 2500k inside an NES case? Do you have any idea how insane that is? Please remove the mere thought of this from your brain at once.

I meant from a performance standpoint, it would be ideal. I have zero intentions of using one for this project. After looking around I have pretty much decided on a Core i3 2510, which is a dual-core that runs at 3.3GHz. For Dolphin I am aware that more than two cores does not really get you anywhere, and as you said the extra heat of the 2500k would just be impractical.

Quote:
I also will need a graphics card that is small and cool-running enough to function in such a limited design. Again, Dolphin emulating Wii at 1080p will be the most demanding thing this computer will ever have to do. Any CPU/GPU suggestions to work within these limitations?

Well you haven't really given us any specific limitations. All you've said so far is that you'll be using an NES case. We don't know how you plan to design this, what kind of power supply, how well ventilated the case will be (are you going to cut a hole for a rear fan?), or if you plan on passively cooling everything.

My limitations are mostly in terms of something physically small and that will be possible to practically cool. I will probably dremel out a hole in the back for a fan, but playing with it will tell me exactly what I need. In terms of design, I will be using a PCI Express riser to allow me to mount the card horizontally in the case, as the NES case is not large enough to have it vertical. For power I will use several picoPSUs, with relays in place to appropriately power on everything at the same time. Power requirements will not be an issue nearly as much as cooling. Passive cooling for this project does not seem like an option by any stretch of the imagination.

You've mentioned using a miniITX motherboard but do you have the space for a low profile graphics card or will integrated graphics be a requirement? BE SURE, don't assume it. Keep in mind high end integrated graphics processors these days are powerful enough for running dolphin at the native internal resolution (640 x 528), but if you want true HD you'll need a graphics card (although llano might be able to do it with an IGP).

I am fully aware that I need a real graphics card to run Dolphin at high resolutions. What I am less sure of is what exactly I need in terms of power for what I want to do, and what will not cook in my setup.

I would seriously reconsider making dolphin a priority for this thing. Dolphin requires top of the line hardware, as I'm sure you realize. Putting top of the line hardware in a system like that just isn't practical (although it is possible, trading dolphin performance away will allow you to use much cheaper parts that produce far less heat).

I enjoy the challenge.

[NaturalViolence]

Quote:I don't think it is going to be easy by any means. But easy projects are no fun.

I like you already, you'll fit in well here.

Also please use the

Code:

[quote][/quote]

tags when quoting text, it's easier on the eyes.

Also I forgot to ask, do you have any specific budget requirements? Any idea exactly how much power we have to work with? Does the system have to be able to play wii games or is GC only ok (this will give us a lot more wiggle room)?

Quote: After looking around I have pretty much decided on a Core i3 2510

This cpu does not exist. You probably meant to say core i5 2510E or core i3 2125 (I suspect the latter). The i3 2125 would be a good choice. Low profile graphics cards usually aren't much better than todays IGPs anyways (especially llano). If it were up to me I would just say screw wii games and use a llano APU for this build, which would still be good enough for running most if not all GC games at fullspeed.

[ketchup3821]

(11-19-2011, 01:00 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Also please use the

Code:

[quote][/quote]

tags when quoting text, it's easier on the eyes.

Yeah, sorry about that. I made that post on my phone, so the BBCode was easier to do manually that way.

(11-19-2011, 01:00 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Also I forgot to ask, do you have any specific budget requirements? Any idea exactly how much power we have to work with? Does the system have to be able to play wii games or is GC only ok (this will give us a lot more wiggle room)?

For power, I'm looking at one of these guys, having this driven by a modified Xbox 360 power brick, which I'm doing because a) I have one lying around, b) I also have plenty of dead 360 mobos to scavenge the port from, and c) plugging an Xbox 360 power brick into a NES is something I find incredibly amusing. That would give me 203W (bounded by the Xbox PSU), and if that turns out not to be enough, I can use some supplemental power from something else, with appropriate adapters and relays to feed what will probably end up being either CPU power or PCI-e 6-pin power (both of which are simply +12v, and I have a dead PSU handy that I can steal ports from to create adapters). Long story short, it'd be nice to stay under 203W, but I could go over if need be.

Budget requirements are "whatever I need, within reason", which I know is vague, but it appears I'm looking at a $90 PSU, a miniITX mobo around $80, a $160 i3 2125, some ~$50 RAM, and a graphics card that will probably end up being no more than $100-150 tops.

Also, cooling. The elephant in the room. A buddy of mine pointed me in the direction of this blower fan. Mounted inside, above a CPU cooler such as one of these (sans the included fan), this could work well to blow all the air out the back (where obviously I'd put in an output vent). Then I could add some intake slots to the bottom, and get some nice bottom-to-top airflow going to keep the whole thing from burning up. It runs on anything from 4v to 12v, so I could undervolt it if ends up being more than I really need, which would also cut down on extra noise I'm sure.

(11-19-2011, 01:00 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote:

Quote: After looking around I have pretty much decided on a Core i3 2510

This cpu does not exist. You probably meant to say core i5 2510E or core i3 2125 (I suspect the latter). The i3 2125 would be a good choice. Low profile graphics cards usually aren't much better than todays IGPs anyways (especially llano). If it were up to me I would just say screw wii games and use a llano APU for this build, which would still be good enough for running most if not all GC games at fullspeed.

Correct, I did mean the 2125. Again, I wrote that post on my phone, so I was going off my memory, which apparently was incorrect.

I'm confident that I can get Wii emulation working on this machine. With something like
this I can mount the graphics card horizontally, and overall give me more options in terms of layout. It would allow me to use a card that isn't low-profile, but of course I still wouldn't be able to use something gigantic.