This is where trim comes in. All deleted data on ssds, get fully reverted to before data was even written state. Defragers do this (if supported).
So you guys don't defrag? Hmmmm
So you guys don't defrag? Hmmmm
Poll: Defrag You do not have permission to vote in this poll. |
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Good | 7 | 63.64% | |
Bad | 0 | 0% | |
Other | 4 | 36.36% | |
Total | 11 vote(s) | 100% |
* You voted for this item. | [Show Results] |
Disk defrag. Truth or lie
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01-09-2013, 09:14 AM
This is where trim comes in. All deleted data on ssds, get fully reverted to before data was even written state. Defragers do this (if supported).
So you guys don't defrag? Hmmmm 01-09-2013, 06:20 PM
Doesn't Windows do it in the background? Its been a decade since I've done a manual full disk defrag.
01-09-2013, 08:01 PM
Disk Defrag: Truth or Lie? It's a lie. There is no such thing as disk defragmentation. It was a conspiracy by Linux hippies to make you think Windows Vista was not the best thing ever.
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to be honest, i thought you guys would know a bit more about modern defrag. guess it's my job to bring you guys up to speed.
yes, windows vista+7 does auto defrag 1am wednesdays. modern defraggers, defrag always, when you're not using resources, up to a point where it is completely efficient. they also have features to write properly in the first place, which windows defrag doesn't do. 3rd party defraggers are faster than windows too. or so they claim. they use windows api, which apparently, make defragging super safe. you can never lose data on the basis that you are defragging ssd's can be defragged and the fact that ssd's work slower when deleting files is why windows 7 has TRIM. this turn's the unused info back to a pre-written state. defraggers also support this. so when you're doing you're own stuff or delete a file, defraggers use windows 7's TRIM to make writing as fast as the first time it wrote. you can choose free/paid. personally i've used paid diskeeper. i've never heard of free ones. i just wanted your guys opinion on all this. but seems like i know more than you guys i'm not going to be using defraggers for a while and see how that impacts the systems... (01-09-2013, 08:02 PM)daaceking Wrote: they also have features to write properly in the first place, which windows defrag doesn't do.What does that even mean? ----------------------------------- Personally, I use MyDefrag with an optimized script (MyDefrag can be configured via scripts) that I downloaded some time ago. The creator of the script made some benchmarks to compare different defragmentation programmes and then based on that data, and with some trial and error, devised a script for MyDefrag that beat most of the other solutions (according to his own benchmarks of course). I've been using it for some years now and am pretty happy with it. There are actually three versions of it, "Optimized Daily", "Optimized Weekly" and "Optimized Monthly". The author recommends "Optimized Monthly" and that's what I use too, since I don't think it makes sense to defrag more often then maybe once a month, unless you did some heavy copying and deleting of files, especially when the HDD is almost full. The downside of the script is that it takes a pretty long time to defrag even a not so big HDD, but since I use it at most once a month that doesn't really annoy me. Here's the link to the scripts, if anybody is interested: Zelda and here's the link to the benchmarks (but remember that those results are pretty old by now): http://hofmannc.de/defragxp/benchmarks_en.html Oh yeah, MyDefrag is free of course, as are the optimized scripts. edit: I voted "other" because I still don't understand what the actual question is 01-09-2013, 10:26 PM
the whole point of defragging is that the file read is all one piece. fragmentation happens when there is no space big enough for one single piece.
windows doesn't care about this. it just puts it anywhere. defraggers look for a space big enough. if one exists, it puts it there. simple 01-09-2013, 10:49 PM
No, Windows does do that. It's just it doesn't necessarily leave big gaps between files, which in ways, it's better to do.
Also, the whole point of TRIM is that it avoids deleting data for as long as possible, and one of the results of this is sometimes extra fragmentation. However, as the seek time on a SSD is so miniscule, you'll never notice the effects of any fragmentation, unless you still use Windows XP, which does it's utmost to destroy SSDs.
OS: Windows 10 64 bit Professional
CPU: AMD Ryzen 5900X RAM: 48GB GPU: Radeon 7800 XT 01-10-2013, 03:45 AM
(01-09-2013, 10:26 PM)daaceking Wrote: the whole point of defragging is that the file read is all one piece. fragmentation happens when there is no space big enough for one single piece.I know what fragmentation is, I just don't know what question you are asking with this poll. (Also I'm not sure if this was even directed at me) 01-10-2013, 09:54 AM
(01-09-2013, 08:02 PM)daaceking Wrote: i just wanted your guys opinion on all this. but seems like i know more than you guys i'm not going to be using defraggers for a while and see how that impacts the systems... That's because few people take disk defragging that seriously, it's not like it's THAT useful... u.u
OS: Windows 10 Pro 64bit Creators Update
CPU: AMD Phenom II X4 960 @ 3.6 GHz Graphics Card: Nvidia GeForce GTX 960 2GB GDDR5 Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-870A-USB3 AM3+ Revision RAM: HyperX 8GB Dual Channel @ 1600Mhz 01-10-2013, 12:29 PM
Quote:So you guys don't defrag? Hmmmm I do, just not vigorously. I always reformat the entire disk before installing an OS or adding data to it so there is usually no need until the disk starts to fill up. When >75% of the space is used up is usually when I start to defrag because up until that point it doesn't make much of a difference to disk performance. And on a 1.5 TB HDD it takes a loooooonnngggg time. Quote:Disk Defrag: Truth or Lie? It's a lie. There is no such thing as disk defragmentation. It was a conspiracy by Linux hippies to make you think Windows Vista was not the best thing ever. That's pretty much how I interpreted the title when I first read it. Glad to know that I'm not alone. Quote:defraggers move data around to make a big space so that the pieces can be kept together in a contiguous region Fixed. Quote:you can choose free/paid. personally i've used paid diskeeper. i've never heard of free ones. Have you been living under a rock? All of the really popular ones are free. I personally use auslogics disk defragger. Quote:but seems like i know more than you guys Somehow I doubt that. You seem to know more than your posts initially led me to believe. The problem is (I'm sorry but there is no nice way to say this) your grammar is poor which makes it difficult for me to make sure that I'm interpreting your sentences correctly. I have not even bothered to address a few things that you have said because I'm not sure that I am correctly interpreting their intended meaning correctly. And todays awards for surprisingly good answers go to: AnyOldName3 Wrote:Technically, it is the delete cycles it doesn't like, as a write to a completely blank location is more or less painless. It needs to put a large current through each NAND block to set it back to being just '0's for any delete, which causes the dreaded transistor decay. The problem is that any data block which has anything other than a 0 for every bit needs clearing before a write, so once the SSD has been used for a while, every write must be preceded by a delete. Other than that, what you wrote is good. AnyOldName3 Wrote:No, Windows does do that. It's just it doesn't necessarily leave big gaps between files, which in ways, it's better to do. Runo Wrote:That's because few people take disk defragging that seriously, it's not like it's THAT useful... u.u
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