Building a Dolphin rig in the fall/winter. + Nvidia shield and General questions.

[Edwii]

★ ★ ★ I would like to take a moment before contiuning for saying thank you so much for all your help. You have already gone far beyond any thing I could of expected I would get from here, or even most places on the web. It's not much but if you can think of a modest game on like steam or something, let me know and I'll try and gift it to you.★ ★ ★

I have done my best to slim down and reorganize the discussion.

►General comments:

Quote:Please take a few things into account when making your decision.

Performance and performance per dollar (cost efficiency). Cost efficiency continues to increase exponentially as price increases up until a certain point, then it begins to reverse. This apex point is the "sweet spot" of maximizing performance per dollar.

I understand and I think I'm alright about keeping a balancing. I'm not being totally efficient, but I'm not being overly wasteful ether.

Quote:Well I recently bought an asus rt-N66U ($140). I like it a lot and it has great range. It's dual band 802.11n. I would advise testing both bands on the shield before determining which one to use. While is may sound like 5GHz is better than 2.4GHz in most cases 2.4GHz will give you better signal strength. Try both out before you decide.

The asus rt-ac66U ($190) is basically the same router except it supports 802.11ac. Which will replace 802.11n in the future. So it's more future proof. Truth be told it's still going to be a few years until 802.11n replaces 802.11g in most devices and even longer for 802.11ac to begin replacing 802.11n so you certainly have a lot of time.

Thank you for the suggestions and the added information, I will be making note of this come the time about getting a router, if my current wont fit my needs.

Round 3:
I've been doing non stop research this past week and a half on these things, the more I learn the more I have to ask.

►Motherboards /CPU / Ram / Overclocking:

Quote:In my opinion asrock has overtaken asus in quality and features. Asus, asrock, biostar, gigabyte, and msi all make good z87 boards though.

Now that the VRM has been integrated into the cpu die there is almost no difference between different z87 motherboards in terms of overclocking potential. Unless you're going for competitive level overclocks which you aren't.

◘Overclocking:
I've decided that there isnt much reason not to OC to an average-above average level. I will be aiming to go with an OC to a is respectable level with out putting unnecessary wear and tear on the components. So pushing it to see what it can do with out trying to squeeze out it's absolute max, if that makes sense?

◘CPU:
I am pretty sure I'm going with the i5 4670k at this point, but if I change my mind again to go with the i7 4770k at this point, I dont think it's going to make a big impact on the over all build for my general goals?

◘Ram: I still have a rudimentary understanding of ram.
I've been hearing two main stances on what ram to use:
-One side says go with 1600, any thing more is basically pointless.
-The other says that going higher is better for stable overclocking.
Ram seems to be almost the same price no mater what it's speed is (1600 1866 2133). So if the mother board is compatible, why not go with higher?

-I made a parts list on PcPartPicker, and it had this notice at the bottom:
"G.Skill Trident X Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR3-2133 Memory operating
voltage of 1.6V exceeds the Intel Haswell CPU recommended maximum of
1.5V+5% (1.575V). This memory module may run at a reduced clock rate to
meet the 1.5V voltage recommendation, or may require running at a
voltage greater than the Intel recommended maximum."
Would that mean I should choose some slower ram, ram that doesn't need 1.6?

-Also Is 2 sticks of 8 better then 4 sticks of 4? Is there much of a differnce between 2x8 and 4x4?
The other thing a few people have said is that it is important that all the components have matching frequencies for overclocking? I'm not totally sure what they mean by that, and I'm not sure if they were talking about older hardware or if it applies to me?

◘Motherboard:
Once determine what speed of ram is right for me, and any other factors that would put requirements on the motherboard, my main concern in what a mobo has to offer is its ability to regulate the systems power depending on the demand.
I often leave my PC on all day to stream video from it or let something download. Leaving it over clocked under those loads consumes extra power and adds stress to the components, but going to the effort of turning down the clock is time consuming.
I know there is technology that would auto adjust the clock/power depending on what the PC is doing, is it universal over all mother boards or is it something I need to specifically look for?

Based on peoples suggestions and reviews: Can you please give me your opinion on these first choices for a mobo and ram:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131989&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID
and
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231617&nm_mc=AFC-C8Junction&cm_mmc=AFC-C8Junction-_-na-_-na-_-na&cm_sp=&AID=10446076&PID=3938566&SID

►Sound

Quote: And I'm assuming that what you did was wire the internal spdif output on the sound card to the internal spdif input on the graphics card. Then used the graphics cards spdif passthrough feature to pass the spdif signal out through one of the dvi ports. As far as I know this is the only way to get digital audio output from a GTX 260 reference design.
"Digital coax" makes it sound like you used an actual coax cable. And I have no idea what a "sound hookup" is so I'm assuming that's what you meant to say.

-Exactly what I meant.

Quote:I am well aware of what ohms are. I study computer science. I'm surprised you stuck with auzentech for as long as you did given their reputation for crummy drivers lately (as you've seen first hand).

Please be sure. It should say the model number somewhere on the receiver.

-I didnt want to come off as condescending or rude about the ohms, just want to be clear.
-Found the manual and its the SR5003

►Cooling / PSU / Case:

Quote:What do you mean by this? Do you mean how much more power would you need if you installed a better HSF? Almost nothing. Fans only use a few watts of power at the most.

Keep in mind stronger PSUs will be quieter since the PSUs built in fan increases its speed as the power draw increases. More power draw produces more heat and therefore requires more cooling. PSUs rated for higher wattages will be under less load and will require less cooling. I do think an 850 watt PSU would be fine for you though.

-I meant going with a more exotic cooling system, that would probably require a notable amount of power. My small 11'x12' bedroom where everything is, including my space heater of a projector, is very stuffy. I have an AC in the room, tho works well, is quite loud and it would be nice to not rely on it so much. So I've been thinking of doing a cooling system that would cool the components with out venting the heat back into the room. As it is, with only the PC on, and at idle, it makes my room about 5*F warmer then the rest of the house, adding the AV reviver + projector + human body heat makes it a sweat lodge with out the AC constantly running.

◘One involving water cooling: Mounting a Radiator to the wall's intake vent, (80" away from the PC) then mount fans to the rad that suck air out of the room, and thru the rad into the wall vent. Requiring a large water pump, a rad, fans, a reservoir? some kind of control unit? and water blocks.
*I am slowly dismissing this option for the fact that, tho it would keep the CPU/GPU cool, and keep them from adding to the heat of the room like I want. The PSU would still be adding heat to the room, in addition to the AV receiver, HD Projector, and any other electronics in the system. Also it would cost a good amount and be a bit of a fragile system.

◘The other switching my entire electronics center to a server rack system, mounting everything but the projector into the rack and have it all vented into the wall intake vent via air thru something like a dryer hose using fans. This would be the only time I would consider ever giving my my beloved wood case. But it's also a very expensive concept that will need additional construction. Still doing research as to how easy I could do it and for how much, server racks come pretty cheap used some times. Tho, I have never worked with a server rack before.
*note these are just some abstract ideas at this time, and ether would probably make my budget plan brake at this time. There is a good chance at this point I will just go with a traditional air cooling system at this time and go with a better solution when the budget is renewed. I thought I would just share my concepts.

Quote:By "drive bay storage" you mean the 3.5" bays for HDD?

And
yeah I would expect a full sized ATX chassis to be quite roomy which is
why I'm surprised you had to use a smaller HSF (heatsink + fan). Can you
snap a photo of the inside so I can see how much space you have? I'm
going to have a look at your case's manual later on to see how much
height clearance is listed for it in there.

Here is a video walkthrough of the wood case(2:54): http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=1ZffiUu59HY&t=174
and some good pictures of a set up here: http://www.legitreviews.com/nmediapc-htpc-8000-wooden-htpc-case_1114/4

Quote:How old is the
PSU? Even good units eventually die. Especially when they are regularly
put under heavy load.

You should check out this site when you're planning your build: https://pcpartpicker.com/
It's a great resource for compiling everything.

PSU is about 2years old.
For the next PSU, Do I need to look for one that is "Haswell compatible"?
I took your advice, and that place is super handy for making a shopping list.

Thank you once again for your help, I look forward to your next reply.

[NaturalViolence]

Here I'll give you something to respond to in the meantime so you don't have to wait so long this time.

Part 1:

Edwii Wrote:-I meant going with a more exotic cooling system, that would probably require a notable amount of power.

The amount of power needed to move a piece of plastic that weighs a few grams in a circle at 500-3000 rpm in an almost frictionless environment is quite minimal. Fans only need a few watts at the most. This is the only part of an HSF that uses any power.

In an LCS (liquid cooling system) the only moving parts you have are the fans on the radiator and the pump. A pump is basically a fan submerged in liquid if you think about it. It has more friction to deal with because it has to push liquid out of the way which is much denser than air. But the amount of power needed is still quite minimal.

Then we have TEC (thermoelectric coolers, also called peltier coolers). Which use similar amounts of power to a LCS. Power is needed for the fan and to generate the heat flux.

Submersion cooling is similar to LCS. Requiring fans for the radiator and a pump to move the coolant.

Vapor chamber cooling also requires only fans.

Phase change cooling (refrigeration unit) is the only type of cooling unit that requires a substantial amount of power consumption (for the compressor). But those are powered externally from an AC outlet and have their own built in PSU. And phase change cooling is considered well beyond the range of overkill. They're huge, heavy, loud, and cost thousands of dollars. Almost nobody uses them.

Edwii Wrote:My small 11'x12' bedroom where everything is, including my space heater of a projector, is very stuffy. I have an AC in the room, tho works well, is quite loud and it would be nice to not rely on it so much.

Edwii Wrote:As it is, with only the PC on, and at idle, it makes my room about 5*F warmer then the rest of the house, adding the AV reviver + projector + human body heat makes it a sweat lodge with out the AC constantly running.

This is completely normal.

Edwii Wrote:So I've been thinking of doing a cooling system that would cool the components with out venting the heat back into the room.

That's either impossible or highly impractical. The heat has to go somewhere. The air in your room is the most convenient place for it to dissipate.

Edwii Wrote:◘One involving water cooling: Mounting a Radiator to the wall's intake vent, (80" away from the PC) then mount fans to the rad that suck air out of the room, and thru the rad into the wall vent. Requiring a large water pump, a rad, fans, a reservoir? some kind of control unit? and water blocks.
*I am slowly dismissing this option for the fact that, tho it would keep the CPU/GPU cool, and keep them from adding to the heat of the room like I want. The PSU would still be adding heat to the room, in addition to the AV receiver, HD Projector, and any other electronics in the system. Also it would cost a good amount and be a bit of a fragile system.

Ok. Ignoring the fact that this is completely insane are you sure that it's an intake vent used for recirculation? Does the room have any outtake vents?

I must also point out that in order to suck the hot air out you'll have to turn on the A/C anyways. Which will recirculate the hot air throughout the rest of the house. I suppose if the vent is angled right you might be able to get it to suck up most of the air via convection currents without turning on the A/C, but certainly not all of it. You'll also have to get the radiator to line up with the vent and block off the rest. This certainly isn't going to look pretty. If you have a wife I would imagine she would be horrified at the idea. And like you said you'll only be able to cool the cpu and gpu that way.

Edwii Wrote:◘The other switching my entire electronics center to a server rack system, mounting everything but the projector into the rack and have it all vented into the wall intake vent via air thru something like a dryer hose using fans. This would be the only time I would consider ever giving my my beloved wood case. But it's also a very expensive concept that will need additional construction. Still doing research as to how easy I could do it and for how much, server racks come pretty cheap used some times. Tho, I have never worked with a server rack before.
*note these are just some abstract ideas at this time, and ether would probably make my budget plan brake at this time. There is a good chance at this point I will just go with a traditional air cooling system at this time and go with a better solution when the budget is renewed. I thought I would just share my concepts.

This is well beyond ridiculous. You do not have my vote of approval on this.

Just stick with a HSF and run the A/C. Does anyone else in the house complain when you do this? Maybe it makes the rest of the house too cold? I can't imagine the noise of the A/C being the only reason that you would want to go to such lengths to fix this issue. Also you could consider getting something like a ceiling fan installed in the room.

[Edwii]

(08-17-2013, 06:25 PM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Here I'll give you something to respond to in the meantime so you don't have to wait so long this time.
Part 1:

Edwii Wrote:As it is, with only the PC on, and at idle, it makes my room about 5*F warmer then the rest of the house, adding the AV reviver + projector + human body heat makes it a sweat lodge with out the AC constantly running.

This is completely normal.

Just stick with a HSF and run the A/C. Does anyone else in the house
complain when you do this? Maybe it makes the rest of the house too
cold? I can't imagine the noise of the A/C being the only reason that
you would want to go to such lengths to fix this issue. Also you could
consider getting something like a ceiling fan installed in the room.

I know it's "normal", but very uncomfortable for any one in the room.
The AC in the room works good for doing it's job, too good in fact. It's a single room floor unit with a air pipe out the wall. I have to keep the door closed on my room when I'm doing anything with the electronics. I need to keep the sound of media in the room and keep the light from the rest of the house out. The rest of the house is reasonably isolated from my room.
You can adjust it's temperature of it any where from 66*F/19*C and up, but that only controls how long the "chill" phase lasts for, as the "chilled" air that comes out of it is always the same temperature. When it's on in such a small room it really makes the air "Chilly" and keeps it there almost non stop. So you might say it always feel ether too hot or too cold, there is no "Goldilocks" temperature with the way things are now.

I'm not sure if your asking if every one is ok with me messing with the walls or running the A/C. I don't do modifications with the structure of the house with out extreme consideration, and connect from the rest of the household, and only if it can be done tastefully. The A/C is a single room unit.

►As regards to my concepts:

Quote: This is well beyond ridiculous. You do not have my vote of approval on this.

Before you dismiss it all together, I want to briefly try and describe better what my concept is(as i feel I did a poor job of it the frist time):
As You probably already know, most AV Components use standard sizes that are compatible with server mounting solutions.

The image on the left shows a nice little cabinet where all my AV components could be mounted into. (note the center image is just an example, the cabinet would be against a wall, not in one)
Using a cabinet/rack like that:
◘I would mount the AV equipment in the center of the cabinet leaving room both at top and bottom.
◘Depending how deep the cabinet is and how it's designed, the back would then be lightly sealed with something like "Corrugated Plastic sheet" allow for minimal air loss but cutting holes in the sheet for any wires.
◘Then fans would be mounted ether on the bottom under the cab, on the front of the bottom, or both, allowing it to suck in cool air from the floor and push it up thru AV components and up to the top hollow space.
*The computer would likely be mounted at the bottom giving it the coolest freshest air.
*if needed, there would be room for added fans to be sandwiched between the AC component layers.
*The computer would also have aftermarket HSF inside it of course.
◘The top hollowed area would be reasonably sealed and have a fan or two at the back or side of the cab sucking the accumulated heated air out. A dryer hose(or something like it) would then be attached to the face of the fan and directed into the wall vent.
*If every thing went according to plan and fit the right dimensions, the server cab would easily hide the dryer hose, which is in the corner of the room any ways.

In theory, it would isolate much of the heat given off my the electronics and keep the heat from entering the air of the room.
The concept is not unlike others done before:




In theory, my concept would help prevent the heat of all the electronics of the room from enter the room.
Essentially, using the Cabinet in my concept, turns it into giant PC case with built in Amp and TV tuner. I could even make server rack adapters for any consoles I like to use. The only unusual thing is the way it would be cooled.

I felt like I did a bad/rushed job of trying to describe my concept the first time, so thank you for bearing with me to hear it restated. If you got the concept the first time, and still think it's ridiculous then I will gladly yelled to your superior knowledge on these matters. Part of my plumbing background also had a small extent of HVAC to it, so I was basing some of my ideas from methods used in the trade.

If my second version did change your mind, I would love to hear your thoughts on it. And also part 2 of round 3 lol.

Thank you very much again, I am very much enjoying our discussions.

[NaturalViolence]

Edwii Wrote:It's a single room floor unit with a air pipe out the wall.

Do you mean that it's a portable unit?

[Edwii]

(08-18-2013, 08:46 AM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Do you mean that it's a portable unit?

Yes I guess so:

It's like the one in the pic, but a bit bigger, and instead of using a window, I have a hole in the exterior wall, not unlike a dry exhaust .

[NaturalViolence]

Yup, that's a portable unit. So it is sucking air in through the vent, cooling it, and venting cold air into the room? Or is it sucking hot air out through the vent? Or both?

[Edwii]

(08-18-2013, 09:25 AM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Yup, that's a portable unit. So it is sucking air in through the vent, cooling it, and venting cold air into the room? Or is it sucking hot air out through the vent? Or both?

I am not totally sure. I know it has an intake vent for sucking in air from the room, and if I understand single hose ACs they need to vent exhaust heat, so I think that's what the hose is for, to vent the exhaust the ac generates. So if I understand what I just read about single hose AC unit's; it's sucking the air from the room, cooling it, and blowing it back into the room, "recirculated air".

[NaturalViolence]

Can you check what model it is?

[Edwii]

(08-18-2013, 10:04 AM)NaturalViolence Wrote: Can you check what model it is?

delonghi pinguino pac c100
http://www.delonghi.com/ca_en/products/pac-c100/

[AnyOldName3]

It seems that someone is actually considering something I thought about for 5 minutes once, then decided would be too much work. Then again, when I thought about it, my house's heating was broken, so I was heating my room with Furmark, so excess heat was not a real consideration.

I now realise I've contributed nothing to this conversation. I still think this is a hell of a lot of work compared to opening a window.