A question for Core i7 owners.

[Ocean]

(09-08-2010, 03:31 AM)Bigsteve3570 Wrote: specs

The game limits rendering of frames in Hyrule field on any specs and settings especially without the hack (and even if it's used) even if you use a 980x and gtx480/5870 (just ask zurginator)

I flat out refuse to believe you can play hyrule field at constant 30fps unless you show screenshots or a video.
Because you are claiming you solved one of the oldest bugs in the emulator just by system specs which is impossible

(people with all sorts of rigs and systems were limited to 24-25fps forever without the hack as well)

You are claiming issue 2499 doesn't exist.
http://code.google.com/p/dolphin-emu/issues/detail?id=720
http://code.google.com/p/dolphin-emu/issues/detail?id=2499

Omegadox, dolphin admin Wrote:This is because the outdoor maps uses a lot of vertices which puts a big load on the
vertex loaders. Our vertex loaders need better optimization.

Every single other area in the game renders flawless, except hyrule field
(which is emulator-limited, not related to specs)

[Xtreme2damax]

Hyrule Field is actually a whole other issue, has nothing to do with the geometry unlike what was originally thought.

The bottleneck is the constant EFB reads/writes, the game is constantly reading and writing the EFB data and associated texture for the minimap, there are several hundred if not thousands of these read/write operations every minute. This doesn't affect other smaller areas in the game, but Hyrule Field is affected due to it's massive size compared to other areas in the game.

What the hack does is detect the texture address for the minimap and remembers that value in memory, this prevents the constant EFB reads/writes so only a minimal amount of data is flushed through the pipeline speeding things up.

Core i7 owners may not experience such drastic slowdowns because the processor and the fast DDR3 ram can cope better with these constant reads/writes. The high bandwidth between the memory, cpu and gpu on the GC/Wii can handle this with no sweat but the PC is more limited. The speed of current DDR3 PC memory, cpu's such as the Core i7 and, a fast gpu are likely enough to not be bottlenecked like older hardware is.

Also Ahem:

Quote:If anyone with an i7 has SMG1/SMG2, please take a screenshot of the game while playing Bowsers Lava Lair in the second world of SMG2 and the Observatory from SMG1.

That will make me feel a tad better about my expensive purchase that I'll be paying on for years to come.

[Bigsteve3570]

(09-08-2010, 05:00 AM)Xtreme2damax Wrote: Hyrule Field is actually a whole other issue, has nothing to do with the geometry unlike what was originally thought.

The bottleneck is the constant EFB reads/writes, the game is constantly reading and writing the EFB data and associated texture for the minimap, there are several hundred if not thousands of these read/write operations every minute. This doesn't affect other smaller areas in the game, but Hyrule Field is affected due to it's massive size compared to other areas in the game.

What the hack does is detect the texture address for the minimap and remembers that value in memory, this prevents the constant EFB reads/writes so only a minimal amount of data is flushed through the pipeline speeding things up.

Core i7 owners may not experience such drastic slowdowns because the processor and the fast DDR3 ram can cope better with these constant reads/writes. The high bandwidth between the memory, cpu and gpu on the GC/Wii can handle this with no sweat but the PC is more limited. The speed of current DDR3 PC memory, cpu's such as the Core i7 and, a fast gpu are likely enough to not be bottlenecked like older hardware is.

Also Ahem:

Quote:If anyone with an i7 has SMG1/SMG2, please take a screenshot of the game while playing Bowsers Lava Lair in the second world of SMG2 and the Observatory from SMG1.

That will make me feel a tad better about my expensive purchase that I'll be paying on for years to come.

I can try getting a screenshot of bowser's lava lair in world 2 tomorrow when I have time with a fraps framerate overlay + settings used;s tarting fresh and I don't have any saved games atm; so I need to work my way there .

[Xtreme2damax]

Just use this save if you have the NTSC-U version.


  53423445.zip (Size: 20.61 KB / Downloads: 90)

[Bigsteve3570]

(09-08-2010, 08:14 AM)Xtreme2damax Wrote: Just use this save if you have the NTSC-U version.

Alright, i'll give it a shot.

Edit: K, I got 15 different images from across the entire level. File sizes are pretty large, so i'm trying to upload them to a site like imageshack.

Edit2: I gotta go out for about an hour or two; i'll leave the files uploading until then.

[Bigsteve3570]

(09-08-2010, 08:22 AM)Bigsteve3570 Wrote:

(09-08-2010, 08:14 AM)Xtreme2damax Wrote: Just use this save if you have the NTSC-U version.

Alright, i'll give it a shot.

Edit: K, I got 15 different images from across the entire level. File sizes are pretty large, so i'm trying to upload them to a site like imageshack.

Edit2: I gotta go out for about an hour or two; i'll leave the files uploading until then.

http://img808.imageshack.us/g/dolphin2010090718314773.png/

Does this link work for you? It is the imageshack album I made.

Settings:
-CPU to EFB Access enabled
-1920x1080 res
-EFB copy to texture
-HLE DSP
-16x AF
-Direct 3d9 + 4x SSAA
-JIT Recompiler
-Revision 6167 (faster than the newest revisions from my experience)
-I never mentioned what my operating system was in my specs : Windows 7 64 bit.

This is a pretty CPU intensive game; GPU doesn't seem to be flexing much muscle. Anyways, I tried to take the screenshots of the worst scenarios I could find. It generally stayed at a 60 solid fps +. Most situations it hovered at 65-75 range with maximum frames being at 100ish (obviously with very little occurring on screen).

Conclusion: If you turn off AA you should never drop below 60 fps from my experience.

[Xtreme2damax]

Awesome, my current system pales in comparison. On that same level I get 32 FPS - 40 FPS max.

[Ocean]

(09-08-2010, 10:24 AM)Bigsteve3570 Wrote: Settings:
-CPU to EFB Access enabled
-1920x1080 res
-EFB copy to texture
-HLE DSP
-16x AF
-Direct 3d9 + 4x SSAA
-JIT Recompiler

ot, but in your opinion, are radeon cards relatively stable on dolphin? Or are there crashes, etc.
I was thinking to upgrade to 5xxx (or 6xxx if they come out before christmas) but most people on the forum use nvidia cards
so I haven't actually read much about the higher-tier performance of those cards in wii/gc games

Not buying it just for dolphin, but I figured there are less driver issues (and for example no efb black screen issues on earlier revs) plus the performance is pretty high.

to stay on topic here's screens you requested with efb-> ram xtreme, using that save you upped. Its with i7 950 but on stocks @3.06

[ninjin]

(09-08-2010, 03:20 AM)Ocean Wrote:

(09-08-2010, 02:39 AM)Bigsteve3570 Wrote: -I don't know what you're talking about not being able to get more than 27-28 fps in Hyrule Field; I've gotten through the entire game with the 6100+ revisions and never had an instance where my emulation dropped below 100%. I had issues with Hyrule field framerate way back without the hack; aside from that one major bug I never got this "27-28 fps".

Do tell what magical revision you are using that gives 100% speed in hyrule field even with the hack turned on

It's nothing, just one of the oldest bugs in the emulator, but if you say so, sure... Do share..
Screenshots would be nice too.

And I'm not talking pre-2nd temple

w3520 @ 4.2ghz HT
gtx 275
6gb gskill pi
etc

overall quite similar to yours
~27 fps w/o the hack
~37 efb to ram
~42 efb to texture

pics: http://img710.imageshack.us/gal.php?g=10573328.png

I use efb scale 3xx w/ no aa (aa doesn't seem to kick in properly) as it looks better than auto + 4xssaa (both have quite similar performance).

I've ran around observatory on smg1 fps ranged from between 64 at the place where the camera goes into overview averages 75-80
disable efb to cpu 75 - averages 85-90

Also, 4 player ssbb is rock solid - not a single slowdown on any stage.

[Bigsteve3570]

(09-08-2010, 01:26 PM)Ocean Wrote:

(09-08-2010, 10:24 AM)Bigsteve3570 Wrote: Settings:
-CPU to EFB Access enabled
-1920x1080 res
-EFB copy to texture
-HLE DSP
-16x AF
-Direct 3d9 + 4x SSAA
-JIT Recompiler

ot, but in your opinion, are radeon cards relatively stable on dolphin? Or are there crashes, etc.
I was thinking to upgrade to 5xxx (or 6xxx if they come out before christmas) but most people on the forum use nvidia cards
so I haven't actually read much about the higher-tier performance of those cards in wii/gc games

Not buying it just for dolphin, but I figured there are less driver issues (and for example no efb black screen issues on earlier revs) plus the performance is pretty high.

to stay on topic here's screens you requested with efb-> ram xtreme, using that save you upped. Its with i7 950 but on stocks @3.06

I haven't had any crashes in recent memory on Dolphin because of my video card and in normal games even with a very high OC with bare minimum cooling (lowest fan speed I can get away with ) I don't run into stability issues. I did have some ATI driver problems from 10.5-10.6 catalyst though where the driver would stop responding for no reason.

Waiting for the 6xxx series would be a good idea. An upgrade from a 285 gtx --> 4xx or 5xxx is kind of "meh". I usually like to be dazzled when I upgrade. Also, 90%+ of the 5xxx radeon cards sold atm are non reference which is lame.